PlummersSoftwareLLC (Dave's Garage)

Gestalt

anyone thoughts on the new enderman video?

I thought he was cool :(

tbfh it has been in the past

3:14 AM

and I don't really like him trying to hide it

3:14 AM

but it is in the past

3:15 AM

I would appreciate it if he would fully explain himself instead of trying to sweep this under the rug

Esther

What if we had a professionally licensed code auditors to check every line of code update before it is released. Would that have prevented the Crowdstrike debacle?

that would be so expensive. Besides programmers are meant to do that while they're writing the code. Because of capitalism, the only successful firms are the reliable ones. Usuaully, cloudstrike is.

Gestalt

anyone thoughts on the new enderman video?

there's probably something behind it, I don't have an opinion on it, I don't know objectively who did what

4:24 AM

Enderman also makes videos to get views

4:25 AM

it's interesting how one video can make so many people change their mind immediately, fascinating human behaviour

there are actual legal documents you can read, and follow, and get the gist without relying on a YTer to tell you what they think.

indeed

4:27 AM

but whatever happened, it's already been to court so justice has been served, it doesn't matter anymore

Yeah pretty much

https://youtu.be/ENQNG85sXRs is any of this true?

Enderman

Dave Plummer: The Man Who Scammed Millions

2

I'm almost certain Dave has already talked about exactly how his business was run and why he got out of it ages ago. I don't remember which video it was in, but I know he explicitly states that he wired his office building when it started, and that there was online advertising involved. I also know he sold the entire business already.

5:44 AM

Richard Stallman is regarded as some kind of hero when he was a massive jerk and a plagiarist for literally decades, and people still think fondly of Steve Jobs despite his decades as an eccentric drug addict with a child born in wedlock. If you can put actual criminal history aside for those, why not someone who is actively trying to better themselves?

anyways my thoughts on the video are "I don't trust this guy who is so obviously fishing for views" followed by "I really could care less if it's true"

Yeah I'm kinda torn because I like Enderman's videos where he does stuff with Windows you aren't intended to do, but I also love Dave's Garage videos and can't imagine that he ever scammed anyone

so I'm watching the video now, he picks apart the utilities saying they're crapware, which isn't true... the average user doesn't know what they're doing and having a program that tweaks parameters in the registry for you is totally fine, it's like what CCleaner does now - nothing you can't do yourself, but makes it easier and one click?

6:43 AM

Dude's spending way too much time fixating on what he thinks is a problem, instead of just saying "I'm such a 31337 pr0 h4x0r that I would never need such shortcuts"

yeah this is dumb, he keeps saying he got scammed becaues the registry cleaner found problems. That's literally what CCleaner does, and that's shareware/payware as well. Yeah I agree the wording makes it sound way more serious than it actually is (none of those problems will crash your computer or make it slow) but it's not a scam... it does exactly what it says on the tin - finds various problems in the registry

drfsupercenter

yeah this is dumb, he keeps saying he got scammed becaues the registry cleaner found problems. That's literally what CCleaner does, and that's shareware/payware as well. Yeah I agree the wording makes it sound way more serious than it actually is (none of those problems will crash your computer or make it slow) but it's not a scam... it does exactly what it says on the tin - finds various problems in the registry

No, there is a difference between ccleaner and scareware

7:38 AM

Scareware will find problems which even don't actually exist

Foxyz

it's interesting how one video can make so many people change their mind immediately, fascinating human behaviour

It's not about one video, it's about what people have learned

7:42 AM

Personally I think I heard something about that scam company from Wikipedia, but for many people this is something new about their guru. It's nothing surprising people change opinion on their guru after seeing stories like this.

At what point did he sell the company?

It’s ‘scareware’ if it tells you there are 40+ ‘problems’ with the registry in a fresh new install of Windows XP though, especially if it can fix 20 for free but expects you to pay to fix the rest. When each fix is just a couple of pretty simple API calls. He must have put much more effort into the features that try to scare people and try to upcharge them than the amount of work needed to actually solve the ‘problems’, which aren’t even problems to begin with.

Deformisani SAS

https://youtu.be/ENQNG85sXRs is any of this true?

The author of the video probably didn't suffer like us youngest gen x about this. This was common back in the day, proprietary software was predatory back then. Things change. At least it wasn't easeus where they would bribe the reviewers to convince other to use their software.

Yeah it was super common, but I'd say there's a line that was crossed with the popup at shutdown at startup. WARNING the user that if they don't pay, they're at risk, and reminding at every possible opportunity is scamming imo

12:09 PM

And like, just admit it openly, we'll understand. You got rich doing shady shit, it's in the past

Scaring people into buying a product is wrong. You're claiming to use your expertise to help them, but you're actually using their naivete to manipulate them It doesn't matter how prevalent in the industry it is, it's wrong. Most of us would immediately disregard any software that does this, because it speaks to the company's values (edited)

Remember. It was 2004 where these things are norm. Compare to today's company pratice, yes it's barbaric but back then it was an income to generate profits. If you're saying they using this practice now? Yes but back then? No. Btw it's called freeware.

Nah, I found all the y2k software just as trashy even back then (well, a few years before, obviously)

Also the current business model learned a lot from this practice. Because those software are relatively offline it's easier to pirate and way easier to get malicious exe.

1:28 PM

I can say to dave that i bought it but in truth i find the exe offline files on somewhere else

Dave didn't run the company alone did he?

1:39 PM

antivirus is always so scummy, mcafee advertising on so many download websites, registry cleaning tools like ccleaner, norton and mcafee installed from the factory and after a month it shows big red warnings to tell you to buy subscription, ...

Remember that McAfee CEO is the current Crowd Strike CEO

McAfee went to the dark side pretty quick but Norton remained noble for longer, iirc. Yeah, they warned about the importance of antivirus, but they didn't make things up And anti virus was critically important back then because Windows was about as secure as a cheese grater (edited)

fendibull

Remember that McAfee CEO is the current Crowd Strike CEO

*CTO

1:47 PM

and whataboutism isn't particularly helpful imo

agreed lol

I've used McAfee, Norton, and AVG. by far the least headache i used on these 3 since 2020? McAfee is the least problematic

fendibull

Also the current business model learned a lot from this practice. Because those software are relatively offline it's easier to pirate and way easier to get malicious exe.

I don't think the current model learned anything good. There's a clear line between Ransomware and those questionable practices. Just taking things to their limit. "Everybody else" is just needlessly making things SaaS

Yeah.

1:48 PM

I probably used the software and find the crack hole in it. because back then? People would just sell those crack software compilation on CD from 2002-2008. the whole DCMA, and Anti Piracy kicks in around 2009 where you can't even find an offline crack for it.

fendibull

I've used McAfee, Norton, and AVG. by far the least headache i used on these 3 since 2020? McAfee is the least problematic

that's concerning, McAfee was installed on my laptop from the factory and it was rather invasive, installing a webadvisor in all my browsers and giving a lot of pop-ups, and after I disabled it I had no antivirus at all

1:49 PM

then I uninstalled it to get Windows Defender back

I disable webadvisor but AVG just giving me: "I think you should prefer buying our ultimate edition, click here to disable it for 2 weeks" 30 minutes later "We lied, but you should buy our ultimate edition" (edited)

Windows Defender have all we need but not we want. so that's good

drfsupercenter

Dude's spending way too much time fixating on what he thinks is a problem, instead of just saying "I'm such a 31337 pr0 h4x0r that I would never need such shortcuts"

Like I said he's just fishing for clicks, which is ironically what he claims to be complaining about.

fendibull

Remember. It was 2004 where these things are norm. Compare to today's company pratice, yes it's barbaric but back then it was an income to generate profits. If you're saying they using this practice now? Yes but back then? No. Btw it's called freeware.

Freeware is free, Dave's stuff would be called shareware

Deformisani SAS

https://youtu.be/ENQNG85sXRs is any of this true?

sadly I believe it is true because he was named in a court case if I recall. he posted the court records in the description.

4:38 PM

the court case also states his name directly.

4:41 PM

it was on his judgment summary page 2, it mentions his name as a defendant.

drfsupercenter

Freeware is free, Dave's stuff would be called shareware

Shareware was, as we might say, "the style of the time" (edited)

Yeah, I really hated that type of program, but everybody was doing it. I liked the id software style of shareware where you could legitimately play an entire game for free and just had to pay for extra levels, not this "it's free" "oh but you can't actually do anything until you pay"

drfsupercenter

Yeah, I really hated that type of program, but everybody was doing it. I liked the id software style of shareware where you could legitimately play an entire game for free and just had to pay for extra levels, not this "it's free" "oh but you can't actually do anything until you pay"

Doom shareware only contains the first like 9 levels of E1, which is like a third of the game at best.

5:12 PM

And I think the Hexxen shareware is only level 1 :P

Was referring to commander keen

5:12 PM

Grew up playing it.

5:12 PM

Doom came later

Ah, and not the world changing title that brought them most of their fame for decades to come?

Nah. I was too young to play doom when it came out

5:16 PM

Random: was Doom open-sourced? I know people port it to everything

5:17 PM

Someone did a source-buy for Keen Dreams, but that was the weakest title in the series lol. I don't know why I'd is guarding the source for the other games so tightly considering how old they are

(edited)

fendibull

Remember that McAfee CEO is the current Crowd Strike CEO

why does everyone hate crowdstrike for one mistake though I might be too dense to get it. It seems to me it's just one mistake and they're generally incredibly reliable. Stupid mistake, sure, but the lack of review that caused this wasn't an issue until it was, at which point they fix it and theoretically we move on with our lives?

Lindon

why does everyone hate crowdstrike for one mistake though I might be too dense to get it. It seems to me it's just one mistake and they're generally incredibly reliable. Stupid mistake, sure, but the lack of review that caused this wasn't an issue until it was, at which point they fix it and theoretically we move on with our lives?

The issue is the root cause of not having policies to prevent it is inside a black box, we don't know if they've got policies that should prevent this or not, we don't know if those policies were followed or not, but we do know that this root issue has happened multiple times this year, just the previous times happened to have much smaller impacts.

5:32 PM

That said, my experience is that CrowdStrike is the most capable and relaible EDR solution out there

5:36 PM

Transparency would go a long way, but with transparency they'd have to balance being respectful about throwing whomever under the bus, whether it's people whom didn't follow policies or whether it's operations not making policies after the first incident or whatever else, ultimately there's humans that made mistakes and while some people are out for blood, if a company just goes "oh yeah this dude fucked up" people will riot for the name and shame (plus legal will have a field day). So right now their response is going to be slow and opaque.

DeepestToaster

The issue is the root cause of not having policies to prevent it is inside a black box, we don't know if they've got policies that should prevent this or not, we don't know if those policies were followed or not, but we do know that this root issue has happened multiple times this year, just the previous times happened to have much smaller impacts.

Ohhh okay so I don't know enough about it. I wasn't aware this has caused issues before. If that's the case I'd agree it's atleast somewhat justified. Imo the only mistake a company can make that would get me to no longer use their services is to not learn from their mistakes. Of course, I have no use for crowdstrike services, so a better example would be say something simple like music streaming software. I used to use youtube music, but google literally never fixed a single issue I had with the app, so after a few years of that I switched to a different one. I can accept mistakes. Even brutal ones, like say a service was down for an entire week. But at the point when the company doesn't care to improve in the future, that's when I'm out. It's why I skipped over tidal and went to Qobuz because I've heard accounts of their apps being crap dating back years. My point being of course that issues are fine, it's repition that makes me not trust a company.

DeepestToaster

Transparency would go a long way, but with transparency they'd have to balance being respectful about throwing whomever under the bus, whether it's people whom didn't follow policies or whether it's operations not making policies after the first incident or whatever else, ultimately there's humans that made mistakes and while some people are out for blood, if a company just goes "oh yeah this dude fucked up" people will riot for the name and shame (plus legal will have a field day). So right now their response is going to be slow and opaque.

Yeah I honestly can't blame them. People go insane online. I wouldn't want to throw my employee under the bus no matter how bad the mistake was. That's just wrong.

Lindon

Yeah I honestly can't blame them. People go insane online. I wouldn't want to throw my employee under the bus no matter how bad the mistake was. That's just wrong.

But people also want to know what happened and aren't satisfied with "there was a staff issue" or any other corporate speak for "an employee fucked up"

DeepestToaster

But people also want to know what happened and aren't satisfied with "there was a staff issue" or any other corporate speak for "an employee fucked up"

yeah true. A middle ground I think would be okay for all parties involved is to explain exactly what caused the issue, without saying who was the culprit(s), and also explain what processes you're putting in place to ensure it doesn't happen again.

Yeah, that sounds good on paper, but you've also got to not fire anyone for a period of time so that correlation can't be made, but also 8.5 Million computers means people are out for blood so someone has to get fired for this, and it's normally an executive that steps down. Which I think is why people are so hung up on digging into the CEO's past

5:42 PM

Hence all the talk about the CEO having been at McAfee during a similar issue

5:43 PM

Does the CEO fall on the sword and genuinely risk being unemployable going forward, or does the CEO stay and drop the sword on someone else?

Lindon

why does everyone hate crowdstrike for one mistake though I might be too dense to get it. It seems to me it's just one mistake and they're generally incredibly reliable. Stupid mistake, sure, but the lack of review that caused this wasn't an issue until it was, at which point they fix it and theoretically we move on with our lives?

Until this latest snafu, the only context that I remember hearing about CrowdStrike was back in ~2017ish; when they were credited with confirming that the DNC servers were hacked by 'Russia' (and given to Wikileaks) and that is where all those emails (DNC conspiracy to select HRC instead of having a democratic process to choose the 2016 candidate ) came from. This has been publicly disputed (by former NSA guy Bill Binny) due to the file timestamps indicating a more rapid method of transporting the files closer to USB transfer speeds. Depending on the news organizations that you trust, you might conclude that CrowdStrike is a totally 'on-the-level' company or some CIA-cutout. I figured the hate was from those who believe the latter. If you look over at their Wikipedia page, it's basically decorated with US foreign policy accomplishments. Which I have to admit is kinda sus.

DeepestToaster

Does the CEO fall on the sword and genuinely risk being unemployable going forward, or does the CEO stay and drop the sword on someone else?

Hmm okay I think I understand now. Far outside my knowledge based, I'm not really sure what I'd do there. I guess that's why companies have HR and PR divisions. There are probably multiple people who's job it is rn just to figure out what they're doing

And their internal legal department is going to be a big factor in deciding what they're doing. I'm sure all of their public facing communication is going to have to go through legal going forward for a bit.

DeepestToaster

And their internal legal department is going to be a big factor in deciding what they're doing. I'm sure all of their public facing communication is going to have to go through legal going forward for a bit.

Yeah, I don't work in infosec but I work in defense--and in any organization like that, I imagine any statement is gonna be reviewed by both legal and by security. (You don't want to inadvertently give away stuff you don't want people knowing.)

2

bad_al_

Until this latest snafu, the only context that I remember hearing about CrowdStrike was back in ~2017ish; when they were credited with confirming that the DNC servers were hacked by 'Russia' (and given to Wikileaks) and that is where all those emails (DNC conspiracy to select HRC instead of having a democratic process to choose the 2016 candidate ) came from. This has been publicly disputed (by former NSA guy Bill Binny) due to the file timestamps indicating a more rapid method of transporting the files closer to USB transfer speeds. Depending on the news organizations that you trust, you might conclude that CrowdStrike is a totally 'on-the-level' company or some CIA-cutout. I figured the hate was from those who believe the latter. If you look over at their Wikipedia page, it's basically decorated with US foreign policy accomplishments. Which I have to admit is kinda sus.

Hmm interesting background. I honestly hadn't heard of cloudstrike before this debacle, so while I understand what you're saying I'm really just learning and don't have anything to contribute. Hope that's ok!

Lindon

why does everyone hate crowdstrike for one mistake though I might be too dense to get it. It seems to me it's just one mistake and they're generally incredibly reliable. Stupid mistake, sure, but the lack of review that caused this wasn't an issue until it was, at which point they fix it and theoretically we move on with our lives?

The mistake caused an international problem for millions of people, and the mistake was a ridiculously dumb one at that.

drfsupercenter

Random: was Doom open-sourced? I know people port it to everything

No idea but I know the version on the 3DO was

2

I actually bought a copy of that, I want to have Rebecca Hyneman autograph it

I got a 3DO recently, along with an Atari Jaguar. The 3DO has actually seen some real use, playing Lucienne's Quest.

drfsupercenter

I actually bought a copy of that, I want to have Rebecca Hyneman autograph it

No idea who that is

The programmer who did the port. I'm half joking, but half not. Everybody hated that port, and her company wasn't given any of the assets needed to do a good port (like the source code!)

11:14 PM

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebecca_Heineman

Rebecca Heineman

Rebecca Ann Heineman is an American video game designer and programmer. Heineman was a founding member of video game companies Interplay Productions, Logicware, Contraband Entertainment, and Olde Sküül. She has been chief executive officer for Olde Sküül since 2013.

11:14 PM

Spelled the name wrong, but yeah.

drfsupercenter

The programmer who did the port. I'm half joking, but half not. Everybody hated that port, and her company wasn't given any of the assets needed to do a good port (like the source code!)

Neat. I've played the patched version, Omnidoom. It's pretty good. The best reason to like the 3DO version is the soundtrack, which may be the best version of the original doom OST out there.

11:14 PM

If the Jaguar version had that OST it would be the best official port

Yeah, they actually had a band play the music live and recorded it for the 3DO version, again because id didn't supply source code

11:16 PM

They apparently shipped the company a floppy disk containing the installer and thought that was all they'd need to port it

11:16 PM

Jaguar port was done in-house by id

drfsupercenter

Yeah I'm kinda torn because I like Enderman's videos where he does stuff with Windows you aren't intended to do, but I also love Dave's Garage videos and can't imagine that he ever scammed anyone

You don't have to pick

11:19 PM

This is just an informative video I made to spread awareness about the Dave's backstory

drfsupercenter

Yeah, they actually had a band play the music live and recorded it for the 3DO version, again because id didn't supply source code

https://youtu.be/m35pIk5wfNk?si=U6L0GQmd2pkaplr7

CyberDreams

Doom 3DO Soundtrack - Map 1 - At Doom's Gate

11:19 PM

Putting that CD quality audio to good use

If Dave comes out and makes his own, I'll probably take this one down

I mean, you're doing more than "informing", you're basically slandering him and implying he's some nefarious figure

11:20 PM

Also hi, I didn't realize you were in this server. I think I tagged you on Twitter (I'm not going to call it X) once and never got a reply

Hey, nice to meet you

drfsupercenter

I mean, you're doing more than "informing", you're basically slandering him and implying he's some nefarious figure

^this. I've already unsubscribed from the uploader and reported the video for harassment, all I can do is say "don't watch it, it's fishing for likes."

drfsupercenter

I mean, you're doing more than "informing", you're basically slandering him and implying he's some nefarious figure

Is it really slander though? All the documents are at the bottom

11:20 PM

Everything is verifiable

11:21 PM

I encourage the viewers to do their own research

11:21 PM

In fact, I have been contacted by Dave, answered him and never got a reply back

dave is busy often

rogueamp

Is it really slander though? All the documents are at the bottom

It's not slandering, everyone is free to share their opinion on things

My tweet quote tree sounds pretty aggressive, I agree, but that's just the magnitude of the scam that happened

11:24 PM

In fact I think Dave was in net gain from all of this

right

I mean, his programs weren't actually scams. They did what they said, at worst they're just unnecessary programs for people like you and me who know what we're doing

I haven't looked objectively at any documents so I don't know

drfsupercenter

I mean, his programs weren't actually scams. They did what they said, at worst they're just unnecessary programs for people like you and me who know what we're doing

It was false advertising

drfsupercenter

I mean, his programs weren't actually scams. They did what they said, at worst they're just unnecessary programs for people like you and me who know what we're doing

I mean, they were pretty much textbook rogues, false advertising for which was done by Dave

sell things you don't need

CPURocket was also shipped with adware

You don't "need" any software

I don't hate on Dave, I'm not his enemy, just in case (edited)

11:27 PM

Or rather, he's not my enemy

I'm thinking like those fake antiviruses that the Indian scammers install that literally does nothing - saying "hey you need to register this" is not adware

I don't do this for views, I want him to tell his story for real

understandable

The whole thumbnail and title of the video seemed very clickbaity and came across like you were trying to make people think he actually scammed people

drfsupercenter

I'm thinking like those fake antiviruses that the Indian scammers install that literally does nothing - saying "hey you need to register this" is not adware

although comparing one crime to another shouldn't change any facts

drfsupercenter

The whole thumbnail and title of the video seemed very clickbaity and came across like you were trying to make people think he actually scammed people

He actually scammed people

Selling programs that technically do what they're supposed to do but aren't really useful is not scamming... That's just business

Did dave ever make a polymorphic extractor???

11:28 PM

Maybe he can partner with piratesoftware to make one

what is a polymorphic extractor

Do you consider CCleaner a scam? It has a registry cleaner too

CCleaner is a scam

yeah

11:29 PM

I think CCleaner also makes Recuva

It's useful, but their licensing is crap since avast bought them so I just use the free one now

11:29 PM

I bought a lifetime license in like 2007 and then one day it stopped working and they said my license is invalid, I wasn't aware that I died

drfsupercenter

Do you consider CCleaner a scam? It has a registry cleaner too

Nobody needs a registry cleaner

3

Not my fault they want to make everything subscription

you only need a registry backup

I don't use it for that. I use it to cleanup temp files

Foxyz

I think CCleaner also makes Recuva

.yes

(copy the hives at %windir%\system32\config)

There's no utility in Windows that automatically empties %localappdata%\Temp

I clean up temp files by hand using TreeSize Proffessional

You just end up getting a ton of wasted disk space

drfsupercenter

There's no utility in Windows that automatically empties %localappdata%\Temp

taskschd.msc + cleanup.bat

I just do it with CCleaner

rd %temp% /s /q

rogueamp

(copy the hives at %windir%\system32\config)

yeah I usually do it from the recovery environment

drfsupercenter

There's no utility in Windows that automatically empties %localappdata%\Temp

it doesn't need that because programs are often constantly using it

Well

like Chromium based browsers do

I have my Greenshot installation set to save all screenshots to local temp folder, and 99% of the time I just share them on discord and don't need them saved lol

The only claim I really don't like I've made within the video is that RAM does not need defragmentation

11:32 PM

I guess it needs it, but it's all done within the kernel

rogueamp

The only claim I really don't like I've made within the video is that RAM does not need defragmentation

I agree that is 100% bullshit

I think a lot of those utilities were made back in 9x days when stuff was kinda crap

11:32 PM

He even said he got contacts at Microsoft (who he later contacted for a job interview) from the Amiga disk caching program he wrote

the position of the data in RAM can't really be changed anyways, applications have the address offsets hard code

1

Like this was old school stuff, when computers kinda sucked

11:33 PM

@rogueamp just curious, where are you living now? You're from Russia originally right?

Foxyz

the position of the data in RAM can't really be changed anyways, applications have the address offsets hard code

i'm not really sure of how that would plan out if you do defrag on the fly

rogueamp

i'm not really sure of how that would plan out if you do defrag on the fly

not lmao

the base address of the process should change, but I don't see a way (edited)

and dynamically allocated memory IDK how you'd move that around

11:34 PM

but RAM is literally

11:34 PM

random access

11:34 PM

who needs defrag if it can seek at light speed

I read through all comments, I loved the feedback and people told me if there are multiple chunks of RAM, the lookup table becomes large and should be shrunk for optimization, make one contiguous chunk out of all these (edited)

11:34 PM

since virtual memory is mapped to physical

right

11:35 PM

I don't know anything that low level

That was my same thought process, I'm not really sure about this, so I probably fd up kind of

Who needs virtual memory anyways

That claim was definitely bogus though, I don't see a way to do this in user mode

identity map that bitch like god intended

This is too much drama for me.

2

J

identity map that bitch like god intended

I mean it's been to court, justice was served

but there is too much drama going on with big youtubers lately I am probably just going to not watch youtube for a while until it all settles back down.

11:37 PM

but it seems like youtube is a platform for people to fight these days.

BlackAnt02

but there is too much drama going on with big youtubers lately I am probably just going to not watch youtube for a while until it all settles back down.

Unfortunately or maybe not unfortunately, drama is just part of human life

11:37 PM

it's never going to end

YouTuber drama mjpopcorn

BlackAnt02

but it seems like youtube is a platform for people to fight these days.

yeah, and the channels that get millions of views can get away with things

Foxyz

I mean it's been to court, justice was served

Dave remained in net gain, legally it has been, but I'm not really happy with how quiet the community is about this

Why?

rogueamp

Dave remained in net gain, legally it has been, but I'm not really happy with how quiet the community is about this

yeah I understand Dave doesn't like to be open about it

Foxyz

yeah, and the channels that get millions of views can get away with things

the worst part is that this drama has gone to a point where people do illegal DMCA takedowns, This is why I don't record youtube and stuff.

He hasn't had anything to do with that company in almost 20 years, why so you need to dredge it up? It's just creating drama.

I expect to see a video from Dave explaining what happened and who did who

drfsupercenter

He hasn't had anything to do with that company in almost 20 years, why so you need to dredge it up? It's just creating drama.

I mean, he sorta got away with it?

but I hope not too much defense in it because people don't take that seriously

Has anyone checked if Dave is on the epstein flight logs

4

I want more stories about Windows coding stuff and less drama

11:39 PM

Like tell me hidden API calls Microsoft didn't intend for us to know

yeah!

I just watch the youtube channels just for something fun to watch but not drama, I watch both dave and enderman's channels I just watch them for the stuff they talk about.

Yeah it all happened like 2 decades ago so I kinda get why he would not bring that up on his own

I also watch both channels

Scamming a million vulnerable people isn't something I would talk about either, but it's deplorable

yeah sure why not

I mean calling them vulnerable is a bit of a stretch

how so

11:41 PM

your grandma is vulnerable

nah

11:41 PM

my granny got on the steroid cycle

11:42 PM

she deadlifts more than me

wow you got a nice grandma

11:42 PM

mine eats more than me

2

Like yes that network speed thing with the changing parameters is something you can do yourself if you know what/how to do it but Dave's program just did it in one click, and it did what it was supposed to do. Whether you think it's necessary as a 1337 haxor* or not doesn't make it a scam

Maybe she is bulking

drfsupercenter

Like yes that network speed thing with the changing parameters is something you can do yourself if you know what/how to do it but Dave's program just did it in one click, and it did what it was supposed to do. Whether you think it's necessary as a 1337 haxor* or not doesn't make it a scam

InternetShield/RegistryCleaner

I only watched half the video, because I saw it at 1am and needed to go to bed, but still... You're overly harsh to everything he released

I think Dave lives in a 10M villa or something, so I'm not really touched

You were crapping on the RAM optimizer and download booster too

rogueamp

I think Dave lives in a 10M villa or something, so I'm not really touched

I'm just assuming that was the main revenue source, but

it was all a bit questionable

rogueamp

I'm just assuming that was the main revenue source, but

I would like to see the earning reports

I would love see a CoffeeZilla report on Dave if Dave doesn't break the silence

11:45 PM

This is really shady and I don't like this at all, there might be more to this

Wtf is CoffeeZilla, an FTP program that makes coffee? (edited)

lmao

The internet detective

So you're basically threatening to doxx the guy if he doesn't disclose his entire past to you

rogueamp

This is really shady and I don't like this at all, there might be more to this

maybe, at this point I have no idea

J

Click to see attachment 🖼️

Me after defragmenting the memory of the computers in the old peoples home

11:46 PM

@J dude I've been paid $100 to install a printer, never underestimate how generous old people are

11:47 PM

My grandma gave me money for signing her into her email a couple weeks ago

drfsupercenter

So you're basically threatening to doxx the guy if he doesn't disclose his entire past to you

His personal life doesn't bother me, his business is very shady, on the other side

J

Me after defragmenting the memory of the computers in the old peoples home

lmfao

I mean, he made a decent salary at Microsoft, and the company you're so mad about is defunct, I don't really see why you need to keep digging

11:48 PM

Dave even says in all his videos he's only in it for the likes and subs, why drag him through the mud like that?

I believe we should dig into it

2

youtuber drama has got bad enough I stopped paying attention to it because I am only on youtube to just watch videos to pass some time, but not to criticize every single person on there. it is the reason why I stopped looking at backgrounds of youtubers, as long as they don't do anything bad in the video's I just don't care about the drama that much.

a 10M villa in Washington doesn't earn itself

Dave has been selling a pay to cheat

11:48 PM

I knew it

Original message was deleted or could not be loaded.

wtf

Dave imgui base

Original message was deleted or could not be loaded.

I don't even know what I am looking at, I think I may have lost a few brain cells.

Original message was deleted or could not be loaded.

my volume was at 100%

rogueamp

I would love see a CoffeeZilla report on Dave if Dave doesn't break the silence

"break the silence"? It's been less than 24 hours... I've had naps longer than this

J

Click to see attachment 🖼️

Me buying InternetShield

DeepestToaster

"break the silence"? It's been less than 24 hours... I've had naps longer than this

It has been longer than that

Foxyz

my volume was at 100%

good thing I had headphones on and not speakers, because if I had speakers people in the building would just stare at me.

he's likely busy now

3

J

Me buying InternetShield

I'm upgrading from CPURocket

maybe making a video about it

Foxyz

maybe making a video about it

I'd love to see that

BlackAnt02

good thing I had headphones on and not speakers, because if I had speakers people in the building would just stare at me.

I didn't have headphones

This conversation is going nowhere, I need to drive now. Was hoping to chat with you about Windows hacking sometime, but I'm not getting into this drama.

Foxyz

I didn't have headphones

oh

rogueamp

I'd love to see that

yeah same, I hope he explains it further and doesn't get overly defensive in it

11:51 PM

an honest response would save him

irql

Click to see attachment 🖼️

me after protecting my client's document object model

what??

sadly since this drama is now happening I think Dave will have to respond to the community because everyone will be questioning him and stuff.

11:52 PM

I can't imagine waking up to a lot of people questioning like that.

yeah indeed

It's a real shame brothers, I wanted to keep it all on Twitter

I get this impression enderman does YouTube for a living (as a source of income) and Dave is just doing it for fun, as he says in most of his videos. This really seems like an unfair fight between two people I actually watch

rogueamp

It's a real shame brothers, I wanted to keep it all on Twitter

even if you leave it only on twitter other youtubers will record videos and do the same thing you did on youtube.

Now let's see if I can get Technology Connections to start a beef with Cathode Ray Dude (jk)

BlackAnt02

even if you leave it only on twitter other youtubers will record videos and do the same thing you did on youtube.

once drama has been started, it will spread quickly

drfsupercenter

I get this impression enderman does YouTube for a living (as a source of income) and Dave is just doing it for fun, as he says in most of his videos. This really seems like an unfair fight between two people I actually watch

I make 1 video per 4 months, I can't make a living out of this

11:54 PM

Dave however can

I didn't realize it was that infrequent tbh

BlackAnt02

once drama has been started, it will spread quickly

I want CoffeeZilla to take on this

That honestly feels like doxxing and that's not cool man

I don't see it as doxxing

drfsupercenter

That honestly feels like doxxing and that's not cool man

daily habits doesn't dox.

Hiring a private investigator to look into someone, with the intent of making it public?

the thumbnail of the video is a little bit overboard in my opinion (task manager with a warning sign "Your computer is infected")

11:56 PM

other than that it's rightful

Yeah, I thought he was accusing Dave of being one of those Indian tech support scammers

11:56 PM

Someone watched The Beekeeper and got a little too self righteous

rogueamp

I make 1 video per 4 months, I can't make a living out of this

it is nice that you do what you like to do which is recording tech videos, don't let people change what you like to do. especially when people try to pressure you to do more than you want to do. (edited)

drfsupercenter

Dave even says in all his videos he's only in it for the likes and subs, why drag him through the mud like that?

I mean, he says that, but that's kind of just to disarm the viewer. He's constantly peddling his book via affiliate link, so he's clearly not just in it for the subs and likes.

does he need more money?

I think it's second nature to make money for him at this point, lol

maybe, I don't know, I can't read minds

2

Dave seems like the kind of person who can never really retire. Like when the local baker in my neighbourhood retired, he sold (or rented?) the main shop out front, but kept baking bread and put a bread vending machine outside so people could still buy his bread

I personally choose to interpret the book plug as a genuine offer of helpful information for those that would benefit from it

does anyone really retire, nobody stops working and doing things until they die

I think the difference is whether you're still selling things after you've retired or not

Foxyz

does anyone really retire, nobody stops working and doing things until they die

I've known people to fully retire, though most of them don't last long after

DeepestToaster

I personally choose to interpret the book plug as a genuine offer of helpful information for those that would benefit from it

I read that book, and it really misinterprets the situation with SoftwareOnline.com

He retired from Microsoft, but still does freelance coding. That's definitely a thing

There are specifically no mentions of that website so the reader isn't able to do their own investigation

Why does there need to be?

maybe Dave convinced himself it's different enough to remember it as so by now

Because what he said in the book is 70% false

He probably just doesn't want to talk about it, it's been settled for 20 years

The victims want to talk about it

yeah and now I hope dave does too

rogueamp

I read that book, and it really misinterprets the situation with SoftwareOnline.com

I don't doubt that, but I also don't doubt that there's a genuine belief that what he's saying on the whole would have been beneficial for him to have known earlier and in turn a belief that knowing this information may benefit others of a similar mind to him

"victims"

12:12 AM

Do you think anyone is still mad about buying a what, $30 shareware program, 20 years later?

2

12:12 AM

I've bought tons of programs that ended up being useless. I'm not going around making videos about them.

I think 2024 Dave is most definitely harmless at this point, but he does have a bit of penchant of misrepresenting details about the past, and likes to present himself a little cuddlier than he really was

Muf

I think 2024 Dave is most definitely harmless at this point, but he does have a bit of penchant of misrepresenting details about the past, and likes to present himself a little cuddlier than he really was

my dad is exactly like that

I might tell people who ask my opinion "oh that program doesn't work, don't buy it" or maybe I'll post on Reddit about it, but I'm not gonna start a vendetta against the people who made it

Muf

I think 2024 Dave is most definitely harmless at this point, but he does have a bit of penchant of misrepresenting details about the past, and likes to present himself a little cuddlier than he really was

The villa has me contemplating

I hope I'm not gonna be like that later

But you're most probably correct

drfsupercenter

I've bought tons of programs that ended up being useless. I'm not going around making videos about them.

People are different, just because you wouldn't do something doesn't mean it's instantly wrong for someone else to

So really, all of this is because you're jealous of his house

12:13 AM

That's the vibe I'm getting

drfsupercenter

So really, all of this is because you're jealous of his house

Pull it out your mouth man, no kidding

12:14 AM

I live a fulfilling life

Then stop bringing up his house as if it's some cardinal sin to have a nice residence...

It's all alleged, tho, maybe it's better to wait for the official response

agreed

Let's be realistic, anyone who owned Microsoft shares in the 90s got rich from them, and Microsoft employees back then always got shares, it's how the company worked. Dave, just like Gabe Newell, cashed out at the right time, and that's where most of his fortune is probably from, if not the seed money for the rest of his fortune. But it does taste a bit off that a part of that fortune was likely gathered by scamming grannies out of their money

3

Muf

I think 2024 Dave is most definitely harmless at this point, but he does have a bit of penchant of misrepresenting details about the past, and likes to present himself a little cuddlier than he really was

I think that's most people, the older they get the more they present themselves as they are currently and as if they were more like they are currently than they were in the past..

Muf

Let's be realistic, anyone who owned Microsoft shares in the 90s got rich from them, and Microsoft employees back then always got shares, it's how the company worked. Dave, just like Gabe Newell, cashed out at the right time, and that's where most of his fortune is probably from, if not the seed money for the rest of his fortune. But it does taste a bit off that a part of that fortune was likely gathered by scamming grannies out of their money

Ohhhh, that's actually very believable

12:17 AM

You might be right

is that sarcastic

No

12:17 AM

This actually might be correct

yeah

Selling a $30 program (or whatever the one time cost was) is very different from "scamming grannies out of their money" and you know it

uhuh

If it was $3000, maybe...

drfsupercenter

Selling a $30 program (or whatever the one time cost was) is very different from "scamming grannies out of their money" and you know it

Watch the video

$30 times a million is still a lot for an app that does nothing useful and just scares the user into spending money, lol

sounds like antivirus

Yeah, AVG and avast and all those do the same thing

Foxyz

sounds like antivirus

CrowdStrike is offended by this, it does something useful if you like having planes grounded

Even removing the bloatware antivirus that comes with your computer is all "do you really want to lose protection?" as if Windows Defender isn't viable on its own

Foxyz

sounds like antivirus

Nowadays truly, I also detested those

Sure, I do too, but again I'm not trying to rile up a fan base to claim somebody is scamming people

alright

drfsupercenter

Sure, I do too, but again I'm not trying to rile up a fan base to claim somebody is scamming people

I think it's important to acknowledge past vs present tense

I should really just stop now, this has been going nowhere for the past hour lol. What's done is done... I just think calling Dave a scammer is really harsh and not actually true.

12:23 AM

https://fxtwitter.com/hbkirb/status/1816392935132520576 I'll share this since kirb and I were discussing it earlier

❤️ 4 👁️ 195

Adam Demasi (@hbkirb)

The marketing tactics do seem iffy, sure it was more normal back then, but I don't know if it sits right with me. I work for a startup building anti-scam protection software, and we've seen it all. Current-day scammers will scare a non-technical person into buying a computer protection plan by showing bogus things like stopped services and "pro...

Totally agreed with that tweet

Wow... People are actually nuts. The program is 20 years ago and it's a norm practice. Like I said. Some of you never use any 1990s and 2000s shareware programs

it is my humble opinion that Tempest 2000 single handedly holds up the entire Atari Jaguar library

Same. I don't think he is a scammer at all. It just the nature of the beast of business life

we talking about edge?

fendibull

Same. I don't think he is a scammer at all. It just the nature of the beast of business life

from what I understand, The only really big issue is the rouges. I wouldn't call the rest malicious in intent, Only really malicious in the same way google is lol

hmmm

Youtubers going to cancelled him over his software is horse ish.

fendibull

Youtubers going to cancelled him over his software is horse ish.

If it was like full ransomware, I would get canceling him. But not for this lol

yeah

1:26 PM

I think Enderman wants to know if Dave got rich from softwareonline.com or from working at Microsoft

I would assume that it was from microsoft. Probably got some kind of stock option and sold in the 2000s when microsoft was worth a lot

that seems most likely

Hi

Sarah Lynn?

If it was like full ransomware, I would get canceling him. But not for this lol

The whole idea of cancelling is dumb to me. So you're telling me because some ppl on the internet are upset I should stop living my life? Why?

I agree, cancelling is monkey behaviour

There's an old joke about A guy takes his truck to the shop, mechanic starts it, opens the hood, listens for a moment, smacks something with a wrench, and the issue stops. Guy is thrilled, asks how much. Mechanic says $125. The guy is shocked, "but it took you 5 minutes and you just smacked it" "Yep" "And you want 100???" "125. 20 for the time, 5 for smacking it, and 100 for knowing where to smack it." ---- Knowledge matters and deserves pay for it, because knowledge is the chief thing anyone is providing. But there's also the shops that rather than change your transmission fluid, they insist you need a new transmission. (edited)

I agree, but to me having deep knowledge and getting deserved pay for it was in working for Microsoft on core parts of the OS. What SoftwareOnline.com was doing was more like insisting that someone needed a new transmission rather than just changing the transmission fluid, or even like insisting that you need a new transmission rather than just topping up the screen wash and inflating the tyres once every six months.

4:26 PM

The deeper the knowledge base you have to draw on, like Dave obviously had and has, the less scammy you should be, since you are clearly capable of making things that are genuinely valuable and high quality.

would be interested in the ratio of people that have coded something 'questionable' that started in the wild west days.. My guess is most of us have created something questionable if only for learning purposes

I don't believe that you can characterize pay as 'deserved' based on the products produced when someone is part of a multi-person org. The more distanced they are from the decision making the less tangible the link between their work and the final product. I could make a beautiful piece of software and my manager could have a directive to use it to scam clients and hand that work off to a coworker.

Well, he had to be pretty above-average as a programmer to even get the job working for Microsoft in the '90s, and then had the advantage of being on the NT team working under Dave Cutler etc. So with both his own skills and the experience of working in a large team of experts. he should have been well set up to be able to make really valuable contributions in his own right.

That's true, but there are invisible boundaries on your influence and a time limit on your legacy. Many decision making roles, ie seniority/management, are judged more on influence than technical skill. Perceiving and manipulating nontechnical influence as a person on the spectrum is borderline impossible in my experience.

Abbendectomy

There's an old joke about A guy takes his truck to the shop, mechanic starts it, opens the hood, listens for a moment, smacks something with a wrench, and the issue stops. Guy is thrilled, asks how much. Mechanic says $125. The guy is shocked, "but it took you 5 minutes and you just smacked it" "Yep" "And you want 100???" "125. 20 for the time, 5 for smacking it, and 100 for knowing where to smack it." ---- Knowledge matters and deserves pay for it, because knowledge is the chief thing anyone is providing. But there's also the shops that rather than change your transmission fluid, they insist you need a new transmission. (edited)

Except he advertised blinker fluid

rogueamp

Except he advertised blinker fluid

I agree. I'm not defending him. I was just talking about making money from your experience vs exploiting people

2

Is sharing someone's IP address without saying who the IP address belongs to legal?

10.37.21.7

That's generally less identifying (as PII) than posting a random street address of an apartment building. Legal? Yes. Ethical? Not if someone will DDoS it for example. (edited)

Probably not legal if you know it's going to get attacked. You'd be complicit in a crime. And if the attacker covers their tracks, the trail may effectively stop at you (edited)

let's say you got 10 scammer's IP addresses, you share them with people that don't know anything about computers, is it a violation of Discord's TOS

Foxyz

let's say you got 10 scammer's IP addresses, you share them with people that don't know anything about computers, is it a violation of Discord's TOS

I think that's part of how AdBlock and some firewalls work, so I would say it's not unethical but not sure about discord. What's the point of sending them if they can't do anything with the information, though?

to show the moderators they are scammers because the moderators don't do shit to remove them

6:54 PM

I showed the moderators the messages, then I sent the scammer's IP addresses, the addresses are all from Pakistan (edited)

6:54 PM

and I got muted in the server because they claim it's against TOS to share an IP address (edited)

Typical discord mod lol

7:06 PM

Ignore them. It's not worth your time

true

7:07 PM

I just can't stand watching how people are gonna get scammed

7:08 PM

I told one of them I'm a 12 year old girl and to my true disbelief he turned into a pedofile immediately

7:08 PM

honestly disgusting they're out there scamming people and I can't stop them

Again this surprises nobody, just report them as best you can to make sure you're not going to be on the wrong end of an investigation and call it there.

yeah you're right

7:14 PM

I want to keep my DMs open in case someone wants to contact me but I get like 5 scammers DM me every day, Discord should do something abou tit

That's a lot, I don't think I've had that many in a week lol

but I'm in 100 servers

I only allow DMs from people who share servers with me, but if you ever join a single crypto discord even by accident you'll instantly get tons of spam. You can now disable DMs from individual servers as well

Hi! I'm new here. I'm trying to install a 32bit PC, a 4 partitions disk with Fat16, Fat32, Fat32 and NTFS to install and boot DOS, win95, win98 or XP. Which Boot menu/Utility do you know that allows me to select the OS at startup? Thanks!

Ununoctium

I only allow DMs from people who share servers with me, but if you ever join a single crypto discord even by accident you'll instantly get tons of spam. You can now disable DMs from individual servers as well

that's good to know, thanks

8:29 PM

I get two scammers on the line, then I tell them both I speak hindi and I might be from the same office

8:29 PM

then I copy paste the messages from one scammer into the other scammer's DMs, get their reply and send that back to the one

8:29 PM

so both scammers are talking to each other but they both think they are talking to me and I can see what they talk about and get their location

Nandio

Hi! I'm new here. I'm trying to install a 32bit PC, a 4 partitions disk with Fat16, Fat32, Fat32 and NTFS to install and boot DOS, win95, win98 or XP. Which Boot menu/Utility do you know that allows me to select the OS at startup? Thanks!

I think Windows XP has a dualboot menu? I would expect if you install Windows XP and Windows 98 you can get a dual boot menu

Nandio

Hi! I'm new here. I'm trying to install a 32bit PC, a 4 partitions disk with Fat16, Fat32, Fat32 and NTFS to install and boot DOS, win95, win98 or XP. Which Boot menu/Utility do you know that allows me to select the OS at startup? Thanks!

I hope you know this, but don't take them online. Everything before 7 is extremely extremely vulnerable online. Not saying 7 is great, but earlier versions are awful

9:45 PM

A guy recently connected XP to on a VM to the internet, let it idle for ten minutes, and found it riddled with malware

normally you got a router inbetween right? I think it's only super vulnerable if you connect with all your ports forwarded and no firewall

Abbendectomy

A guy recently connected XP to on a VM to the internet, let it idle for ten minutes, and found it riddled with malware

you mean eric, but he had no protection

yeah I saw the video too, he wanted it to be like dial-up direct connection to the internet

Foxyz

yeah I saw the video too, he wanted it to be like dial-up direct connection to the internet

even the title was clickbait

I'm just not sure what good protection exists in 2024 for early Windows. https://youtu.be/6uSVVCmOH5w But yeah Eric

Eric Parker

What happens if you connect Windows XP to the Internet in 2024?

zoii

even the title was clickbait

meh that's common on YouTube

he forgot to say without protections

he mentioned it in the video if I remember correctly

Foxyz

he mentioned it in the video if I remember correctly

but not in the tilte

9:48 PM

or thumbnail

Aside from network protection, what modern protection exists in 2024 for windows XP?

but normally with a router your machine shouldn't directly be visible to the internet no matter what it runs

so ppl will think windows xp is super vulnerable

Abbendectomy

Aside from network protection, what modern protection exists in 2024 for windows XP?

no idea, but probably SOMETHING still exists for Windows XP

zoii

so ppl will think windows xp is super vulnerable

well it is super vulnerable

9:48 PM

from the local network

9:49 PM

or if your wifi got vulnerable ports forwarded to you

Foxyz

no idea, but probably SOMETHING still exists for Windows XP

Nothing modern and worth a damn, I'd think

well there is of course some people still gonna be using Windows XP

9:49 PM

maybe some obscure business

or backend for machines like atm, medical machs

I have Windows XP VM and it's fine with connecting to the internet, internet browsing is fine

Yeah but if they're using XP, they don't care about modern security standards

yeah

Foxyz

I think Windows XP has a dualboot menu? I would expect if you install Windows XP and Windows 98 you can get a dual boot menu

All versions of NT do.

Abbendectomy

A guy recently connected XP to on a VM to the internet, let it idle for ten minutes, and found it riddled with malware

This was massively over exaggerated, he ran SP0 with no updates and firewall disabled :P

VCSMaster

All versions of NT do.

so normally it's just partition and install?

VCSMaster

This was massively over exaggerated, he ran SP0 with no updates and firewall disabled :P

and fully port forwarded I believe too

9:52 PM

if your ports are closed the outsider can't even see you have Windows XP without you sending an outgoing request first

TC is probably just playing around, and that's fine, but for anything that matters, don't use old abandoned OS

Foxyz

so normally it's just partition and install?

I've tried all the way back to NT4. it automatically handed me a boot menu including a DOS install I forgot about lol

Foxyz

if your ports are closed the outsider can't even see you have Windows XP without you sending an outgoing request first

Yeah

Abbendectomy

TC is probably just playing around, and that's fine, but for anything that matters, don't use old abandoned OS

If that was the case the world would be in a lot of trouble a long time ago

9:52 PM

An awful lot of things require older versions of your favorite operating systems

Abbendectomy

TC is probably just playing around, and that's fine, but for anything that matters, don't use old abandoned OS

I wonder if PowerPC builds of MacOS are vulnerable

9:53 PM

because who builds malware for 1. Mac OS and 2. compiles it for PowerPC

Foxyz

I wonder if PowerPC builds of MacOS are vulnerable

They probably make up so little of the userbase that it's not worth writing bespoke attacks for it

yeah

VCSMaster

If that was the case the world would be in a lot of trouble a long time ago

Tbh, we have been. Every year or two, we find vulnerabilities that have been open for years and kept quiet

Same case for XP on older CPUs (edited)

I connected my 1998 PowerPC Mac to the itnernet regularly and never saw any malware appear, googling cat photos worked fine

Meltdown, WannaCry, CURL issues

Good luck finding legitimate software that runs on XP on a Pentium M

lmao

9:54 PM

I'm sure osmeone has an archive of it

Abbendectomy

Tbh, we have been. Every year or two, we find vulnerabilities that have been open for years and kept quiet

right and xp source code is open now

Foxyz

I connected my 1998 PowerPC Mac to the itnernet regularly and never saw any malware appear, googling cat photos worked fine

Lol my Quadra 950 still connects to the internet routinely for CDDB

Foxyz

right and xp source code is open now

Is it? That's kinda neat

Abbendectomy

Is it? That's kinda neat

yes unintentionally it is

2

Ah that makes sense. I was wondering, didn't hear it was licensed open source but heard the source was leaked.

Hello

12:47 AM

How are you all?

good, how are you?

Trading one of my cars away tomorrow. Sad day!

aw

that plymouth was never good to me anyways

2:02 AM

it looks real pretty but man its terrible to drive

rogueamp

10.37.21.7

One time while I was on Discord call with you in your server, showing off my Task Manager, someone sent their IP address like that and people were discussing if it was dangerous or not. Then I mentioned DDOS and got instantly banned.

Foxyz

One time while I was on Discord call with you in your server, showing off my Task Manager, someone sent their IP address like that and people were discussing if it was dangerous or not. Then I mentioned DDOS and got instantly banned.

RIP

ddos isn't really dangerous either

4:19 AM

its just really annoying

2

4:20 AM

but yeah idc if someone gets my IP, I don't have open ports since I use tailscale to a load balancer

Beom

ddos isn't really dangerous either

It can obfuscate another more dangerous attack, though that's fairly rare and not something that's wasted on home users

DDOS'ing a home user would probably be more funny and sad, rather than scary

https://youtu.be/ENQNG85sXRs?si=D5eUkN-p0hZPNdvC

Enderman

Dave Plummer: The Man Who Scammed Millions

Beom

ddos isn't really dangerous either

Yes and talking about DDOS is legal, but committing it is a crime despite it not being dangerous. Even in Enderman's server I got banned over just mentioning it without warning. In most other servers when I mention or send an IP address I get muted because they call it doxxing. It seems like the not so tech savy people have no clue what an IP address is, they think it's something super scary "oh no my IP has been hack" (edited)

Well, DDOS is disruptive like blocking a door with your car is. It's temporary and easily remedied, but it does affect people (Eventually the attacker will get bored, if not stopped lol) It's also possible, though not the best method, to do unexpected damages, the cyber equivalent of breaking someone's sidewalk, or "crushing" the septic tank or something. (edited)

yes, committing it is illegal

José Barroso

https://youtu.be/ENQNG85sXRs?si=D5eUkN-p0hZPNdvC

I made a lot of comments about this yesterday without watching the video. I figured it was shady software. It is, as someone called it, mostly "Blinker Fluid" which is closest. The softwares barely had a use and made themselves as annoying as possible and primarily adware. So yeah, it's worse than imagined.

José Barroso

https://youtu.be/ENQNG85sXRs?si=D5eUkN-p0hZPNdvC

I am actually severely discontent with that video, I'll remake it

8:29 PM

Many things have been pointed out

sounds good! Can't wait to see an updated perspective

Is this about the court case from a long long time ago?

Anyone know to to read a Traceret read out

i saved him

Hey Dave, what is the song that you use in your recent intro's? It's awesome!

mrjengel

Anyone know to to read a Traceret read out

Lots of people

can i turn my htc one m8 android phone into a windows phone?

The Cubis

can i turn my htc one m8 android phone into a windows phone?

https://xdaforums.com/t/converting-android-htc-one-m8-to-windows-phone.3282601/

Converting Android HTC One (M8) to Windows Phone?

Hi, this could be asked before or for the first time but I was searching without finding a good solution. Is there any chance to convert my HTC One M8 from Android to Windows Phone? If it is possible did someone tried it before. And thank to...

damn..

Foxyz

I think Windows XP has a dualboot menu? I would expect if you install Windows XP and Windows 98 you can get a dual boot menu

I'll see if it allows me 4 boot options

Nandio

I'll see if it allows me 4 boot options

XP will allow you as many boot options as NTLDR can display

Abbendectomy

I hope you know this, but don't take them online. Everything before 7 is extremely extremely vulnerable online. Not saying 7 is great, but earlier versions are awful

Totally offline. I just download and copy info from a pendrive or cd

^his comment was a major overexaggeration based on one video that itself sought to exaggerate the problem

VCSMaster

^his comment was a major overexaggeration based on one video that itself sought to exaggerate the problem

Anyway I want the computer to be just a museum of OS and proper software

no internet required (edited)

fair enough

5:11 AM

well if your machine is capable of it, you can install them in order of release and you will automatically get correct names in the boot menu

5:11 AM

9x and other DOS based versions of windows MUST be first and I believe you can only have one

5:12 AM

95, 98, and ME will show up with the correct name. Anything else will show up as "MS-DOS" or "Non-DOS operating system"

5:12 AM

hope that helps!

VCSMaster

well if your machine is capable of it, you can install them in order of release and you will automatically get correct names in the boot menu

I will try different combinations

5:14 AM

Last case scenario, a couple of HDD and enable/disable each according of what I want to boot. But a menu with the 4 would be amazing

Nandio

Last case scenario, a couple of HDD and enable/disable each according of what I want to boot. But a menu with the 4 would be amazing

if you use NT versions you can have as many as you want. NT4, all editions of 2000, XP, Server 2003, etc will all coexist with each other in the boot menu as long as you are chronologically correct

5:17 AM

the problem is that 9x does not work like NT and has no boot manager at all. It's a boot sector loader straight into a copy of DOS that runs the windows shell

But I remember that msdos 6.2 has a boot dual or multiple boot menu... I think

5:43 AM

Maybe i should have a dos and win9x HD and another for XP

You should be able to use grub to manage all the different windows installs you want, though it would be a fairly manual process to install and configure

6:05 AM

I would start with install in order from oldest to newest and see if it "just works"

Nandio

But I remember that msdos 6.2 has a boot dual or multiple boot menu... I think

Does it? I've never seen it. You can use one of the F keys on startup to bypass autoexec but I'm pretty sure there's no actual menu.

Hello from my dell dimension 3000 that I installed arch on (edited)

whoa sick!

8:55 PM

I plan on making a native discord app for Windows XP, OS X 10.6 and iOS 5 or 6

You plan to connect xp to the internet

Hello everyone

8:57 PM

How do I protect my Document Object Model from hackers

DeepestToaster

You plan to connect xp to the internet

yes it's fine to do so

9:12 PM

my old smart tv also connects to the internet without security updates

9:12 PM

as long as I don't start opening my ports or download anything malicious nothing happens

9:12 PM

there's only a connection to the outside world if you explicitly allow it or make a request first

Respectfully disagree with the framing of "fine". Though that may boil down to a disagreement on what definition of "fine" we're each using

9:18 PM

Something that can be done by those knowledgeable enough and falling under their own individual risk limits... sure.

9:19 PM

Something that should be presented as "safe for the average user"? I disagree.

but average users aren't gonna install Windows XP

9:20 PM

I mean what's the worst thing that could happen, someone wipe your HDD or something, reinstall windows

Most people don't have backups.

9:21 PM

And when they start exploring I do find people try all sorts of things we wouldn't expect

right

9:23 PM

but a discord app is not dangerous, it only needs to send requests to discord.com

I suspect there's a significant amount of younger people that find Dave's content and then find their way here and want to explore and will hear about things being fine and think that in turn means it's harmless for them to try as an early thing to try

yeah I think it's harmless to try install windows xp and connect it to the internet

9:25 PM

the dangerous part is if you begin downloading suspicious things or visit suspicous websites

9:25 PM

just google and stuff is fine

I think most people who would fit that criteria I described wouldn't only connect and do nothing. They would click things.

yeah and if they click things, and they happen to somehow get a virus

9:26 PM

they can either get rid of it or reinstall

Foxyz

just google and stuff is fine

Malvertising is a thing

9:28 PM

I think we're of differing perspectives where I'm trying to keep the focus on safe/advisable not what is possible. And I think there is an amount of responsibility to let that distinction be clearer for the younger/less experienced crowd.

telling people not to try things is not very educational

9:30 PM

the computer isn't gonna explode or anything from a virus

9:32 PM

I think it's actually a good thing to get a virus if you don't have any important data on the computer without backup, you can learn how to get rid of it by for example running the virus again but with procmon active and see what it does to the system

Easing in is generally a better experience and results in fewer people being scared off from the learning. Sure some people might learn better diving right in, and maybe you were one of those (I was), I still value that so many more people were turned off from learning about computers because of their initial experiences being more extreme than what they expected from how it was being talked about by those more knowledgeable and experienced than themselves.

true but I can only learn by diving in, even if it's super overwhelming, you just gotta dive in and enjoy being super overwhelmed at first

And I'm not saying you shouldn't learn your way, I'm saying it's valuable to be clear that your approach has increased risk compared to other approaches that way someone seeing what you're doing then can make an informed decision on whether or not following your approach is a good fit for them or not.

9:49 PM

As an aside, you mentioned running the malware a second time with procmon to see what it does, if you haven't encountered it before I'd recommend flare-vm for more modern malware on more modern systems.

any.run

9:54 PM

but in the end it doesn't matter, everyone does on their computer what they wanna do on it

9:54 PM

(as long as it's legal of course)

9:55 PM

I wanna make software for obscure operating systems just because I enjoy doing it

9:55 PM

can maybe put some old devices that are considered ewaste to good use

Foxyz

(as long as it's legal of course)

People do what they want including illegal things

The point wasn't about controlling what people do on their computers... the point was on the value of perception and framing.

10:00 PM

Any.run is expensive

10:00 PM

Also most things I test take longer than the times they allot

I think this is the updated video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GeF9AjlqP8

Enderman

Dave Plummer: The Man Who Scammed Millions

Keep in mind none of this is meant to hate on Dave

Foxyz

Keep in mind none of this is meant to hate on Dave

You're correct

10:49 PM

My previous video was pretty much slander

10:50 PM

So I put it down, this one is actually good

Yes, really appreciate it. Thank you!

2

by the way, goodbye Xbox 360 Store

Foxyz

I plan on making a native discord app for Windows XP, OS X 10.6 and iOS 5 or 6

iOS 6 and XP would be pretty awesome! I'd love to see that if you ever get it working.

DeepestToaster

Respectfully disagree with the framing of "fine". Though that may boil down to a disagreement on what definition of "fine" we're each using

So you don't consider yourself knowledgeable? I suppose that explains the disagreement.

VCSMaster

iOS 6 and XP would be pretty awesome! I'd love to see that if you ever get it working.

I recently made a Spotify app for iOS 6 and also have done a YouTube app for Mac OS 10.6

1:22 AM

I haven't uploaded the source code for iOS, I'll do that when I get time and also see if I can get it to work on iOS 5 or even lower, I tried to use iOS 2 and 3 APIs

Just MemTurbo'd my pc

1:22 AM

and I got that just booted feeling

whoa

My memory must have been SUPER fragmented

yeah super fragmented!

Foxyz

I recently made a Spotify app for iOS 6 and also have done a YouTube app for Mac OS 10.6

Neat. Interestingly, when I last ran Snow Leopard, YouTube would play in safari if you didn't mind the awful formatting

I already worked on Discord app for MacOS but had problems because the Discord API's SSL certificates aren't trusted on old iOS and MacOS

1:26 AM

but for Spotify on iOS I had done a little workaround so I'll just reuse that library I wrote

VCSMaster

Neat. Interestingly, when I last ran Snow Leopard, YouTube would play in safari if you didn't mind the awful formatting

yeah it worked until recently, someone had made like tensixtube and tenfivetube which just open webkit, but that stopped working and it's rather inefficient

1:27 AM

so I made an app that uses QuickTime player to stream the video and it also supports picture in picture and stuff

1:28 AM

but there isn't a lot of demand for apps for obscure operating systems so I usually just make it until it mostly works but don't add many features

Interesting

1:28 AM

I miss WoWtube, tbh

for discord the biggest challenge is probably the hcaptcha stuff

1:28 AM

I'll have to make a little webview that loads a captcha thing or something

1:29 AM

discord's api itself is super clean

1:29 AM

YouTube's API is garbage

Well thats no surprise. It's too bad discords API is so nice but their client sucks so bad

yeah I guess the Discord devs are great at JavaScript

1:30 AM

but the apps are also just built in html css and js

1:30 AM

I'm not sure about the mobile app on iOS and Android now though, they're not the most stable

1:31 AM

the old versions of the Discord app crash because they don't do error handling properly, if you have an account that doesn't have any fancy new things in it anywhere the app works fine

VCSMaster

So you don't consider yourself knowledgeable? I suppose that explains the disagreement.

I'm guessing this was sent before reading the remainder of the conversation...

DeepestToaster

I'm guessing this was sent before reading the remainder of the conversation...

Usually when someone says "old thing unsafe!!!!!" I don't bother reading any of the rest of the conversation because it contains basically no valid information.

That's an excellent way to miss out on context and nuance in a conversation. If you're going to chime in without showing enough respect to read the whole conversation why should anyone value your opinion

are old things unsafe? Things don't become less safe over time, if it's unsafe after 10 years it must have been unsafe when it was new too, people just might not have known about it, or they might have

New stuff is unsafe too, it's not like they've only been fixing bugs.

but the internet is the only entry point from the unsafe outside

1:48 AM

if you don't start plugging in usb or dvd

aakova

New stuff is unsafe too, it's not like they've only been fixing bugs.

sometimes I wish they've only been fixing bugs

Foxyz

are old things unsafe? Things don't become less safe over time, if it's unsafe after 10 years it must have been unsafe when it was new too, people just might not have known about it, or they might have

They become more at risk over time as the barrier to entry on attacks decreases...

Windows has so many bugs, they only keep replacing technologies with new ones that lack features, then get forced to add those features back which introduces new bugs

DeepestToaster

They become more at risk over time as the barrier to entry on attacks decreases...

yes indeed

1:52 AM

but our routers are normally the only thing exposed to the public internet

1:53 AM

I can imagine if you use Windows XP on some public network you can be at risk of someone on that network attacking you or someone can open up the ports to your device

DeepestToaster

That's an excellent way to miss out on context and nuance in a conversation. If you're going to chime in without showing enough respect to read the whole conversation why should anyone value your opinion

Why would I value someone's opinion who spouts unresearched known-false information?

a couple weeks ago I was on a hotel wifi, I casually went to the default gateway and entered username admin, password admin and I could see everyone on the network and open ports and stuff

There's no reason for me to read the rest. I showed up to tell you off and move on

but I was just looking around, I didn't touch anything

Yeah lol never ever use public anything

it shows how insecure they can be

Always always a bad idea. Public wifi is terrible, public chargers are often pinned.

VCSMaster

Why would I value someone's opinion who spouts unresearched known-false information?

what if you have done research but other people gave you false information

VCSMaster

There's no reason for me to read the rest. I showed up to tell you off and move on

Awesome, excellent example of a positive community

Foxyz

what if you have done research but other people gave you false information

Almost every time I hear that statement it's "I watched 2 minutes of a Michael MJD video, and didn't really understand half of it"

lmao

DeepestToaster

Awesome, excellent example of a positive community

Would it be more positive for people to blindly believe every word ever typed?

never blindly believe anything

Exactly my point.

don't believe me blindly

VCSMaster

Would it be more positive for people to blindly believe every word ever typed?

That is completely different from ignoring what someone says with the goal "tell them off" ...

2:00 AM

That isn't constructive or useful

what is useful

2:01 AM

I guess useful is what you interpret it as

Foxyz

what is useful

Listening to understand rather than hearing to respond

that depends on the circumstance

No

if you're taking a quiz and you gotta give the answer first to win you gotta hear to respond

Knowing the material and being able to understand quickly and provide correct answers is more valuable than spouting wrong answers quickly

agreed

2:10 AM

but everyone has their own understanding capacity

2:11 AM

and how quick you can reply just depends on how much you've been trained by thinking about the correct answer or correct answers in similar environments

2:12 AM

it's interesting to see how neural networks in computers show these same properties

2:12 AM

chatgpt can sput wrong answers quickly though

DeepestToaster

Listening to understand rather than hearing to respond

What you don't "understand" is that I know what you were saying, and that what you were saying was functionally incorrect. Because you clearly did not have a solid grasp of the concept at hand, I did not feel the need to send you 6 paragraphs of actually correct technical information in response.

2:37 AM

If you wanted real information you would have one Google search (or watched the video to the end, or read it's description) and you would have come to the same conclusion many others have.

2:37 AM

Clearly, you just wanted to provide your own input into someone else's situation without knowing the extent of their knowledge or the limitations of your own

2:38 AM

So rather than have a proper intellectual discussion with you, I found my time better served by giving you a slap on the hand, so to speak. "That's wrong. Don't do that again."

2:38 AM

When you directly spread misinformation, don't expect a happy response from those involved.

2:39 AM

Anyways I found the problem with my Daihatsu, the fuel pressure regulator is shot. The diaphragm is stuck all the way in the open position (or torn, not sure, but it has most certainly failed.) If you cap the regulator's return line (bad idea, don't do this, dangerous), the car will start and run just fine.

VCSMaster

Clearly, you just wanted to provide your own input into someone else's situation without knowing the extent of their knowledge or the limitations of your own

If you had understood what I said you'd understand that I was in no way talking about Foxyz situation nor their knowledge. I even explicitly talked about how it can be a fine thing to do and may be a good approach for their specific situation. You're attacking a stance I did not take.

3:05 AM

I was talking about a philosophical concept with regard to helping people into being interested in and learning about technology. You're hung up on an oversimplification of a specific technical detail.

DeepestToaster

If you had understood what I said you'd understand that I was in no way talking about Foxyz situation nor their knowledge. I even explicitly talked about how it can be a fine thing to do and may be a good approach for their specific situation. You're attacking a stance I did not take.

So you didn't suggest that older computers shouldn't be connected to the internet?

DeepestToaster

You plan to connect xp to the internet

Then what was this?

4:08 AM

Don't BS me.

4:09 AM

This was about your comments implying "old thing bad."

DeepestToaster

I was talking about a philosophical concept with regard to helping people into being interested in and learning about technology. You're hung up on an oversimplification of a specific technical detail.

Philosophy and intelligence do not mix.

VCSMaster

Then what was this?

One single message out of a larger conversation that you refuse to even attempt to comprehend.

VCSMaster

Philosophy and intelligence do not mix.

They mix just fine when the people involved are intelligent and communicating in good faith.

DeepestToaster

They mix just fine when the people involved are intelligent and communicating in good faith.

Congrats on being neither!

DeepestToaster

One single message out of a larger conversation that you refuse to even attempt to comprehend.

The one message that tells me you're ill informed at best.

4:21 AM

Did you also read the entirety of the Time Cube website? If you see an insane man on the side of the road, do you sit and listen to his entire rambling?

VCSMaster

This was about your comments implying "old thing bad."

On the front of "old thing bad" since you're stuck there and can't seem to move on without it being spelled out for you. Old things with known and unknown exploits are higher risk than newer things with only unknown exploits as the barrier to entry for known exploits is much mower than the barrier to entry for unknown exploits. To oversimplify this concept for the sake of brevity does not mean that the oversimplified statement supercedes the more nuanced statement.

Or do you also just dismiss them both because the first words you heard were moronic.

VCSMaster

Did you also read the entirety of the Time Cube website? If you see an insane man on the side of the road, do you sit and listen to his entire rambling?

I've never seen this website. So no.

DeepestToaster

On the front of "old thing bad" since you're stuck there and can't seem to move on without it being spelled out for you. Old things with known and unknown exploits are higher risk than newer things with only unknown exploits as the barrier to entry for known exploits is much mower than the barrier to entry for unknown exploits. To oversimplify this concept for the sake of brevity does not mean that the oversimplified statement supercedes the more nuanced statement.

Since you don't seem to have a very good grasp of reality, the absolute most basic usage statistics show "They are not in mass use." Stop and think for a second, an attacker is going to look for the widest userbase possible. They are not going to make a directed attack towards Windows 95 users, even if they know an easy way in. There is absolutely nothing of value for them to gain by doing this. As Foxy mentioned, the people using these machines on networks don't need backups and don't need to concern themselves, even if such attacks were to occur, because the information stored on the machine is all replaceable and the machine itself is entirely noncritical. No attack directed at such a machine would ever have an effect. I'm oversimplifying because anyone with two brain cells to rub together should go "Huh, Windows XP has a worldwide market share of 1% and so there is no reason for an attacker to select this platform as a target."

4:26 AM

There is nothing to be gained from performing such an attack and so the liklihood someone will bother to do is extremely low, on top of the attack bringing the user no concern whatsoever.

4:27 AM

To argue otherwise would be to ignore all of human nature and to ignore simple statistics.

4:27 AM

I know what you're saying, and it absolutely does not matter. Which, again, is why I went and slapped you on the wrist.

from what I've seen connecting a Win XP PC directly to your modem would cause security issues, but just connecting it with a router in-between should be fine

1

LotP

from what I've seen connecting a Win XP PC directly to your modem would cause security issues, but just connecting it with a router in-between should be fine

The one video that demos this also port forwards every port, disables firewall and defender, and runs on SP0 with no updates.

1

XP is still used to host major production systems in large enterprises and many midsized businesses. I have an AS400 in production at one of my customers. Saying old things aren't targeted because of low marketshare shows a lack of knowledge of the actual security landscape. I get to see these targeted all the time still.

Nobody is going to intentionally use SP0 and nobody is going to bother disabling Windows Firewall. At the barest minimum, nobody is ever going to forward every port to the machine, either.

3

DeepestToaster

XP is still used to host major production systems in large enterprises and many midsized businesses. I have an AS400 in production at one of my customers. Saying old things aren't targeted because of low marketshare shows a lack of knowledge of the actual security landscape. I get to see these targeted all the time still.

Alright big guy, when was the last large scale attack against Windows Server 2003? If you have a production system, you are absolutely not running XP.

4:30 AM

I was management for a large auto parts retailer a few years ago and we also ran AS/400s directly connected to the open internet. They had been up for decades and the plans to take them down don't go into motion until a few years from now. We never had any downtime.

Define "large scale". As for the last attack of a server 2003 system that cost a company a million dollars or more. Less than a month ago.

DeepestToaster

Define "large scale". As for the last attack of a server 2003 system that cost a company a million dollars or more. Less than a month ago.

I shouldn't have to define large scale, you said "Major production systems in large enterprises." It is YOUR job to provide that information.

DeepestToaster

Define "large scale". As for the last attack of a server 2003 system that cost a company a million dollars or more. Less than a month ago.

I have no way to prove or disprove this (the attack), but I will say that nobody playing Far Cry on their Pentium D is going to lose $1,000,000+ if the machine accidentally gets wiped. (edited)

Major production systems in large enterprises aren't typically hit en-mass... and I didn't make the claim that they were. You're telling me to defend a claim I didn't make.

You mentioned specifically that you work on "major production systems" in "large enterprises" and ended it with "I get to see these targeted all the time"

4:33 AM

To deny making that claim is either a deliberate lie or stupidity on your own part

Ok, yes I do see the automated attacks all the time that get blocked by IPS doing their job.

4:34 AM

That's hourly

4:35 AM

But that's not something I can provide you evidence of for obvious reasons.

That's why I didn't ask for evidence. I'm sure if what you say about your profession is actually true, you're probably contract and couldn't say in good faith anyways.

4:37 AM

I'm going to cut this short because I have better things to do than argue with people online: Connecting your Windows XP install to the internet for a few laughs and to make getting software on and off it easier is NOT a major security threat and you need not concern yourself like it would be. The only way you are going to be at risk is by storing important personal information on it and taking several steps to make it directly accessible to attackers, none of which can be done accidentally or implicitly. XP nor any other old operating system is going to put you at direct risk just by being connected to your router. It's not going to instantly become a Terminator and kill you and steal your identity like literally hundreds of people will actively claim online.

4:38 AM

I will not be reading or replying to any further messages addressing the topic.

VCSMaster

I'm going to cut this short because I have better things to do than argue with people online: Connecting your Windows XP install to the internet for a few laughs and to make getting software on and off it easier is NOT a major security threat and you need not concern yourself like it would be. The only way you are going to be at risk is by storing important personal information on it and taking several steps to make it directly accessible to attackers, none of which can be done accidentally or implicitly. XP nor any other old operating system is going to put you at direct risk just by being connected to your router. It's not going to instantly become a Terminator and kill you and steal your identity like literally hundreds of people will actively claim online.

And I largely agree... which was covered in the earlier conversation.

Anyone here still using 486 or p2 or p1?

got a p4 somewhere is closest, was using it as an edge ssh server but its just in a corner now, kinda wish i still had an old 486

VCSMaster

I was management for a large auto parts retailer a few years ago and we also ran AS/400s directly connected to the open internet. They had been up for decades and the plans to take them down don't go into motion until a few years from now. We never had any downtime.

I am unaware of AS/400 ever being exploited. It even defended itself against me when I was QSECOFR.

The AS/400 itself doesn't have too many exploits, most of the time you just take advantage of it's lack of support for more current more secure communications protocols to get windows creds/tokens of the windows devices that talk to it.

DeepestToaster

You plan to connect xp to the internet

I connected 98 and all the way to Windows 8.1 to the Internet, nothing happened

Foxyz

yes it's fine to do so

Yep

Foxyz

whoa sick!

Should I install windows XP home edition, pro or MCE?

fendibull

Anyone here still using 486 or p2 or p1?

Not daily but I do have all three of those types of machines

Oh, I just want to re-experience Windows 3.1 again.

Linux Lover

Should I install windows XP home edition, pro or MCE?

Is there any reason not to go with MCE? It's the same as XP with a bunch of free add-ons.

Still believe 3.1 is the only Windows best OS ever made.

VCSMaster

Is there any reason not to go with MCE? It's the same as XP with a bunch of free add-ons.

True

fendibull

Oh, I just want to re-experience Windows 3.1 again.

Dosbox. It won't work right on a P1 / P2 for the most part anyways, theres no drivers for anything from that era.

But I have a legit product key for home tho

You're looking at 386/486 for 3.x

Linux Lover

But I have a legit product key for home tho

It doesn't matter, XP product activation got cracked a long time ago and the activation servers are down anyways

can i486 sx run xp?

zoii

can i486 sx run xp?

No 486 can run unmodified XP

3:28 PM

Even if it could, you should not. Even on a Pentium 233 XP is painfully slow

VCSMaster

Even if it could, you should not. Even on a Pentium 233 XP is painfully slow

How about an i386?

The Ubiquiti Enterprise Fortress Gateway is now out. I'm sure Dave will be excited about that

Linux Lover

How about an i386?

XP won't run on anything older than a Pentium without extensive kernel modifications. People have gotten it going on a 486 recently but anything below a Pentium II is useless in XP.

VCSMaster

Philosophy and intelligence do not mix.

but can you have philosophy without intelligence?

VCSMaster

Congrats on being neither!

hey, don't get too offensive alright, keep it civil

Linux Lover

Should I install windows XP home edition, pro or MCE?

well that depends solely on your needs or what product key you have, I usually just install Pro, if you want Media Center and I think some extra themes like Royale I believe, MCE has some extra things in it

So uhh... I found the part of this case that shows what condition it was actually in before they cleaned it purely for health and safety reasons lol

10:14 PM

Once I clean it up tho... it's restomods all the way down. I have zero inhibitions about cutting up this particular antique.

ookay wow that's quite the clogging

This thing was clearly submerged halfway in water. I won't bother testing the power supply that came with it lol

ThumbWarriorDX

This thing was clearly submerged halfway in water. I won't bother testing the power supply that came with it lol

yeah I was wondering if it had rust on it

I feel so justified in tearing this thing down from the rivets to bare plates

10:25 PM

Like some metal needs to be bent back into shape and touched up too.

yes

Which allows me all of the freedom to cut this thing to bits and make it support a giant front radiator

wow creative

Yeah I had a bunch of ideas for the other one of these I run but like... it's in good condition I can't drill it up.

10:28 PM

On a piece of crap I just like... have to do decent metalworking. Cut straight and file a lot lol

clearly a german creature

ThumbWarriorDX

On a piece of crap I just like... have to do decent metalworking. Cut straight and file a lot lol

yeah understandable

10:53 PM

reduce reuse recycle

This trash came up in my YouTube recommendations today for some reason and Dave should be made aware of it https://youtu.be/dZthG1fXctg -

Nara Sherko

Dave Plummer: The Man Who Scammed Millions ENQNG85sXRs (ENDERMANCH ...

11:12 PM

To be clear I'm not saying I agree with it in any way shape or form it's just something that he should know about - and have removed if at all possible.

11:16 PM

Seems to be a reupload of this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GeF9AjlqP8

Enderman

Dave Plummer: The Man Who Scammed Millions (in 2006)

Powerpeecee

This trash came up in my YouTube recommendations today for some reason and Dave should be made aware of it https://youtu.be/dZthG1fXctg -

Dave is aware and replied to it so we know he knows

11:57 PM

I don't think it should be removed even if it's not the most constructive

11:59 PM

and it's not meant to be malicious towards dave even though the thumbnail is exaggerated by putting a thing on task manager that isn't real

2

Foxyz

but can you have philosophy without intelligence?

Yes, absolutely. I would argue that's what almost every philosopher who ever lived was. Wisdom and intelligence are not the same thing. Many of the "greatest" philosophers were alcoholics or homeless for a reason.

Foxyz

I don't think it should be removed even if it's not the most constructive

Unfortunately, when more people see the video hating Dave than the videos Dave himself puts out, I think it becomes a problem.

Foxyz

and it's not meant to be malicious towards dave even though the thumbnail is exaggerated by putting a thing on task manager that isn't real

a title like "The man who scammed millions" is not exactly neutral ground either

3:25 AM

it's a highly sensationalized video fishing for clicks and likes

3:25 AM

it is absolutely a negative influence as a whole

Powerpeecee

Seems to be a reupload of this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GeF9AjlqP8

Heya, so I think Dave is just hiding, hoping the water cools down soon... yeah, lemme get LegalEagle

Like i said. The nature of those business practice was normal on 2000s. Especially before 2008. It's a proprietary software with shareware attitude. If it released on 2018? Yes it's a scam but things were different back then. The problem with people generally they expect the old software would run the same on contemporary

8:02 AM

The video author probably used easeus software though

fendibull

Like i said. The nature of those business practice was normal on 2000s. Especially before 2008. It's a proprietary software with shareware attitude. If it released on 2018? Yes it's a scam but things were different back then. The problem with people generally they expect the old software would run the same on contemporary

Obviously it wasn't "normal" when you have to pay 190k after a consumer protection lawsuit

11:44 AM

with 250k more suspended on the condition that you stop said practices

Yeah, until he got sued but the other developers and publishers are not that innocent though. (edited)

Okay so what

11:44 AM

The other developers are not famous youtubers that hide their past

That is a very stupid answer. he famous because he works for microsoft, not by promoting the software.

Are you ESL?

Yeap, you're a troll. so do the rambling on someone else that can entertain you. since you didn't even use internet on XP era? It's not worth to argue about this

I am saying the reason the other people do not get talked about is because they are not famous

11:47 AM

Saying something is right because other people did it as well at the time is an incredibly useless argument

"Yeah, I'm new here so I'm going to troll the author" waste time on something else

The author?

fendibull

"Yeah, I'm new here so I'm going to troll the author" waste time on something else

If you can't reason on the merits of your arguments that is fine but there is no need to call me a troll when I approach the conversation in good faith

i'm just tired to repeat new users and people who jump the bandwagon just to be cool

11:50 AM

you know what, before my parting, accusing him over his old business practice is like blaming the german over ww2. it's old and we're beating a dead horse.

fendibull

Like i said. The nature of those business practice was normal on 2000s. Especially before 2008. It's a proprietary software with shareware attitude. If it released on 2018? Yes it's a scam but things were different back then. The problem with people generally they expect the old software would run the same on contemporary

Just like sexual intimidation was standard practice in Hollywood until the me-too movement?

VCSMaster

it's a highly sensationalized video fishing for clicks and likes

pull the balls out yo mouth man, that video has 15k views, the rest does significantly better

1:46 PM

here's the stats if you wonder

1:47 PM

dave has indeed scammed millions, and the title clearly states it happened in 2006

1:47 PM

so just pull the sack out and finish that video

1:48 PM

this will remain public until dave has responded fully and honestly

1:50 PM

the rationale in the remake is clear as day, so you have no defense (edited)

VCSMaster

Unfortunately, when more people see the video hating Dave than the videos Dave himself puts out, I think it becomes a problem.

the hate is 100% deserved if people decide to judge him for that

1:53 PM

and putting that in public is very important

1:54 PM

so it isn't a problem, Dave isn't some sort of god

1:54 PM

And he's in fact opposite of that, a scammer in the past, a serial one

1:54 PM

I didn't mention SammSoft in that video, another scam company he ran

1:55 PM

Post-softwareonline

1:58 PM

It surfaced after the remake, Xeriton also had some questionable claims that have been edited throughout the history of the site, so Dave has embellished/faked his contributions in the past

1:58 PM

Dig even deeper, you'll find more garbage like this, I fuckin bet, so your stance is very weak and you're for some reason taking a side, even though you're a man likely significantly older than me, gross

2:01 PM

Grill me for what I've covered wrong or just don't speak, it's embarrassing

2:02 PM

CryptoZoo happened 5 years ago now? Let's defend Logan Paul, he's a saint

Powerpeecee

To be clear I'm not saying I agree with it in any way shape or form it's just something that he should know about - and have removed if at all possible.

If he removes this video, it's clear admission of guilt, so let that happen, I'll just make it public again

1

VCSMaster

it's a highly sensationalized video fishing for clicks and likes

Thumbnail and title are obviously designed for that, it's common practice on YouTube these days

VCSMaster

Unfortunately, when more people see the video hating Dave than the videos Dave himself puts out, I think it becomes a problem.

I think it's a problem how quick people judge, they have this natural tendency to pick a side and consider the other side "bad" like monkeys living in clans in the jungle

VCSMaster

Yes, absolutely. I would argue that's what almost every philosopher who ever lived was. Wisdom and intelligence are not the same thing. Many of the "greatest" philosophers were alcoholics or homeless for a reason.

what does homelessness and alcohol have to do with intelligence

2:16 PM

I agree that knowledge and intelligence are totally different things, take ChatGPT for example, it has all the knowledge but pretty much 0 intelligence

rogueamp

I didn't mention SammSoft in that video, another scam company he ran

https://en.softonic.com/author/sammsoft

2:19 PM

Proper management of RAM memory is key to system performance, but after working on the computer for a few hours memory is usually clogged.

2:20 PM

I didn't know memory got clogged? Maybe if you're out of storage so there's no room for paging

ram does not get “clogged” maybe this could mean memory leaks but memturbo wouldnt be able to fix kernel memory leaks, and regular memory leaks are just caused by programs that can be killed

yeah it's obviously just more questionable claims

2:55 PM

I wonder if Dave wrote those descriptions himself

wipet

ram does not get “clogged” maybe this could mean memory leaks but memturbo wouldnt be able to fix kernel memory leaks, and regular memory leaks are just caused by programs that can be killed

Most often when a program memory leaks it ends up just freezing the system for a bit and then crashes

Foxyz

Thumbnail and title are obviously designed for that, it's common practice on YouTube these days

Doesn't the first line of the description say something like "can we make it to 20k likes"?

Foxyz

what does homelessness and alcohol have to do with intelligence

Because 1500-2000 years ago if you couldn't do anything useful you were homeless. Nowadays you get to be a shareholder

3:36 PM

Or a vlogger

When an extraordinarely biased person asks for a neutral point of view, they always want to hear their opinion reflected in that pov

3:41 PM

It's usually a sign of insecurity or fragile ego

3:41 PM

This is why politics exist and it's so pungent

3:42 PM

That's why twitter is a bad idea generally too

3:42 PM

People love echo chambers, they think their opinion is the best

3:45 PM

I think my video is a great example why politics and journalism has become so radical and rotten lately

3:49 PM

No matter what you show, even axioms and things that absolutely took place non starter, there are always going to be ignorant echo chamber participants and trolls, and if you respond to them in any fashion, you lose. The worst part is that they think the same but they're absolutely sure they're in the right, though their claims aren't backed up by any evidence and they just follow a cult

3:50 PM

So I kinda lost, but that's a rule of thumb, you have to suppress honest journalism and instead cultivate an opposite echo chamber, it's only easier and way more effective

3:51 PM

Politicians figured it out, this is why we can't have nice things in the world

3:54 PM

Politics are just a more general case of this, when there are N cults and people blindly follow the one they choose assuming the rest are trolls or being malicious, ignore everyone else and act like assholes. Critical thinking is dead

3:55 PM

Listening to the other party is also dead, and that's why everything is radicalized

3:56 PM

Anyway this is my manifesto thanks for reading

VCSMaster

Because 1500-2000 years ago if you couldn't do anything useful you were homeless. Nowadays you get to be a shareholder

what on earth is "useful" it's just a concept

rogueamp

People love echo chambers, they think their opinion is the best

yes, they pick a side and make their idea stronger with confirmation bias

rogueamp

I think my video is a great example why politics and journalism has become so radical and rotten lately

journalism is kind of stupid, like with the crowdstrike everyone on the news said it was Microsoft's fault and things like traffic lights were affected and other bs claims

and it's even worse because the media is even relatively easy to manipulate see intel claiming the issues were just micro code, and then a short time later adding the oxidation problem, just so the mainstream media would run with the micro code story

If anyone here already doesn't have WinDbg installed, they should get it because it can tell you what actually crashed the system unlike the vague stop code and driver name. (edited)

4:09 PM

interesting the first 3 times it did this, it was when i was using the github dekstop app.

4:14 PM

The fact it crashed when the Github app was opoened twice or thrice sounds like a very strange coincidence.

LotP

and it's even worse because the media is even relatively easy to manipulate see intel claiming the issues were just micro code, and then a short time later adding the oxidation problem, just so the mainstream media would run with the micro code story

Yeah the population is dense

4:17 PM

We as humans are very smart but the human population is very dense

4:18 PM

This is why info wars are so prevalent now and also so effective

4:18 PM

It only takes one fallacy to take down the mind shield of a human

GhostMiner #FixTF2

If anyone here already doesn't have WinDbg installed, they should get it because it can tell you what actually crashed the system unlike the vague stop code and driver name. (edited)

all of these dump files containt the same data, so it must be one script or function. (edited)

Say info noise, a human can only hold iirc 7 objects in their mind? So if a media outlet wants to hide something, they'll spam something else

4:19 PM

Something outrageous that will create backlash, but also cover up the original subject that needs to be hidden

4:20 PM

I understand it as a human, and many probably do, but god fucking damn the population is still susceptible to this

4:21 PM

It just pisses me off, it's so easy to manipulate public opinion, narratives are dirty art

4:22 PM

And yet some would think this is "redditor speak" and blindly trust everything still uhfixjxojfjgisonfnsojd

4:22 PM

I hate this world

GhostMiner #FixTF2

If anyone here already doesn't have WinDbg installed, they should get it because it can tell you what actually crashed the system unlike the vague stop code and driver name. (edited)

oh that's interesting to see

rogueamp

It just pisses me off, it's so easy to manipulate public opinion, narratives are dirty art

yeah it's ridiculous

4:24 PM

most people don't consider looking at things from a step back

rogueamp

Say info noise, a human can only hold iirc 7 objects in their mind? So if a media outlet wants to hide something, they'll spam something else

I take everything from the media with a grain of salt since when they talk about subjects I have more knowledge about I see how much nonsense they spread

4:26 PM

just like ChatGPT, humans can be confident liars without even being conscious of it

4:26 PM

what if I am speaking nonsense but don't realise it

GhostMiner #FixTF2

If anyone here already doesn't have WinDbg installed, they should get it because it can tell you what actually crashed the system unlike the vague stop code and driver name. (edited)

i have a suspicion it's the "aero flyout fix" which just makes the battery and few other win7 flyouts displaywith thick borders. I don't even use the battery flyout and rest is fine. gonn keep it disabled, and let's see what happens. (edited)

LotP

and it's even worse because the media is even relatively easy to manipulate see intel claiming the issues were just micro code, and then a short time later adding the oxidation problem, just so the mainstream media would run with the micro code story

I currently don't know exactly which CPUs are affected even

Foxyz

I currently don't know exactly which CPUs are affected even

from what i can tell, all 13th and 14th gen CPUs, but the degradation happens faster on chips with more load which is why the biggest issues are the i9 CPUs and also many of the i7 CPUs i5 CPUs have had very few reports if any (edited)

4:44 PM

and 14th gen was hit harder because Intel pushed it more while it was essentially just a refresh

That's very concerning

6:38 PM

I thought Intel said 14th gen is not affected by oxidation

I have no idea, we just gotta wait until people know more about what's really going on. Intel seems to be in trouble, AMD is more power efficient too.

Foxyz

what on earth is "useful" it's just a concept

I could read you the Merriam Webster definition, if you like.

capable of being put to use

Foxyz

capable of being put to use

don't forget the "especially" right under that statement.

I don't know if it's just me, but things have been super awkward in general for days

What is the name of this bios chip? Whant to make sure that it is ex 3.3V and not 1.8v so i burn it out with my programer cant finde entything on google

The Cubis

What is the name of this bios chip? Whant to make sure that it is ex 3.3V and not 1.8v so i burn it out with my programer cant finde entything on google

maybe this ? https://www.gigadevice.com/product/flash/product-series/spi-nor-flash/gd25b127d.html

GD25B127D-SPI NOR Flash-GigaDevice.com

GigaDevice can provide GD55X02GE Flash and solutions for a breadth of applications. GigaDevice's industry-proven products are renowned for high performance and low power consumption.

Developer X

I don't know if it's just me, but things have been super awkward in general for days

Yes I am very awkward

aakova

maybe this ? https://www.gigadevice.com/product/flash/product-series/spi-nor-flash/gd25b127d.html

Dosent seem right

The Cubis

What is the name of this bios chip? Whant to make sure that it is ex 3.3V and not 1.8v so i burn it out with my programer cant finde entything on google

https://netcomputadores.com.br/p/25b127ds1g-ci-de-bios-128mb/101667

25B127DS1G Ci de Bios 128MB Serial Flash 3.3V 25B127DSiG | Net Comp...

, 25b127DS1G, W25Q128JVSiQ, W25Q128JV, GD25B127D, GD25B127DSIGR, 25B127DSIG, 258127DSiG, 258127DS1G

I've been sitting on the sidelines on this one. He's in Russia, never reached out to me for comment, and has already had to re-make his libel/slander manifesto once. I've decided not to watch either one, since (a) he lacks any credibility, (b) he's just reading allegations out of a lawsuit, not the outcome of the suit, and (c) why give him any satisfaction? I was there, so I know what happened, and feel no need to disabuse him of his misstatements. For my audience, though, it's different. It kind of forces my hand in that respect, so I figured I should give them some background. You can also refer to my first book, which has a section on it. Or my Wikipedia page, which is accurate. But here goes. [Post too long, split it in 2]

7:39 PM

Starting in college in the late 80s, I sold shareware versions of utility programs, beginning with HyperCache for the Amiga, and it’s how I put myself through college. Nearly 20 years ago, I sold the company and have focused on open-source projects available on GitHub. Back in 2006 the company was investigated by the local attorney general. Here's what happened. All our software was shareware, meaning users could download a fully functional trial version for 30 days. If they found it valuable, they could register it (buy it) with a 30-day return period, though we honored returns indefinitely. When buying, users could enter a registration key, download the full version, or receive a CD by mail for $5.95 including shipping. Since many people preferred physical media in those days, after a lot of user feedback, we defaulted to the CD option. This default selection of the disc by mail was considered “negative affirmation billing” under Washington state law because the CD cost more than the download-only version. Additionally, the apps would show daily reminders after the trial expiration. We adjusted this to weekly reminders as part of the settlement. We also agreed to a number of common-sense advertising guidelines. The ads had been typical of the early internet space, and are not how I’d do it today. The case was settled amicably. We were able to demonstrate that the software did what it advertised and that we had flexible return policies supported by local, live phone staff. We offered refunds and agreed to several compliance measures, which we fully implemented. The state re-audited us a few years later before I sold the company, and we were confirmed to be in full compliance. I hope this won’t impact the community we’ve built around tech history and autism. I appreciate your understanding and support.

LotP pinned a message to this channel. 7/31/2024 7:41 PM

pinning so it's easier for members to find later

tho i will say he shows in the video that he reached out on twitter, got a single reply from you Dave, and then he was left on read

what's wrong with not replying

He never reached out to me. He never asked a question. He eventually replied to my "WTF?" message after launching his video. Still not a single question or followup, so he's completely unconcerned with accuracy. I haven't watched either one. He can call a tune, but I don't have to dance to it. Article 128.1 of the Russian Criminal Code (criminal, mind you... not civil) provides stiff penalties for "the dissemination of knowingly false information that discredits another person". You know, like saying someone is a felon when they've never even had a speeding ticket. Article 152 of the Russian Civil Code further provides for compensation for moral damages, financial compensation, and so on. The delta between the two videos (and his own admission of inaccuracy) is something of a guilty plea on that one. At the end of the day, people can consider the source and draw their own conclusions. Folks can always shoot me an email with a specific and polite question. I answer all my email personally, or do my best to! (edited)

Enderman thinks you're hiding something, he isn't gonna stop until he's sure there's nothing more to it. Personally I don't care about the drama about vintage software, I do care about you and Enderman, you both make very interesting content, I'd like to have more of that instead of a game of attack and defend with no clear goal. I'd be happy if we could all forget and forgive at some point and get along.

One could easily say something like ProcessLasso is also a scam because how dare you not trust the almighty, infallable, windows process scheduler (this is sarcasm). Silly drama nontheless (edited)

So I polished up the aluminum parts of the underwater lian li case looks pretty good. But it doesn't work without the steel parts and I hadn't taken a close look yet. Oh dear god.

8:54 PM

anodized aluminum seriously beats galvanized steel at resisting water damage

8:55 PM

Also these were galvanized and I have to refinish them so they get painted. I'm not made of metal shop chemicals and car batteries

8:59 PM

It says something about the 2000s that Lian Li's cheap cases were pure aluminum but the swanky ones were full of steel. The economics of this have changed a lot lol

Is it just me or is this cpu dead

well I think it's common for computers to whine? So far I haven't seen a computer that doesn't make noises, even my iPhone whines when it's charging or doing something.

9:29 PM

or on my laptop, when I do something GPU intensive you can hear it think

It's referred to as coil whine, yes

but would it mean it's dead because if it makes noise, there is electricity flowing so could it make noise if it was dead and not able to do anything

9:31 PM

it's definitely interesting when for example running an LLM locally, every time it spits out a word you can hear little robot noises

davepl1968

He never reached out to me. He never asked a question. He eventually replied to my "WTF?" message after launching his video. Still not a single question or followup, so he's completely unconcerned with accuracy. I haven't watched either one. He can call a tune, but I don't have to dance to it. Article 128.1 of the Russian Criminal Code (criminal, mind you... not civil) provides stiff penalties for "the dissemination of knowingly false information that discredits another person". You know, like saying someone is a felon when they've never even had a speeding ticket. Article 152 of the Russian Civil Code further provides for compensation for moral damages, financial compensation, and so on. The delta between the two videos (and his own admission of inaccuracy) is something of a guilty plea on that one. At the end of the day, people can consider the source and draw their own conclusions. Folks can always shoot me an email with a specific and polite question. I answer all my email personally, or do my best to! (edited)

ah you're right, he only replied after you wrote to him i misremembered what was shown in the video my bad

it's not entirely true but I'm not gonna start an argument, I know Enderman will

Foxyz

well I think it's common for computers to whine? So far I haven't seen a computer that doesn't make noises, even my iPhone whines when it's charging or doing something.

it heats up wery fast to

davepl1968

I've been sitting on the sidelines on this one. He's in Russia, never reached out to me for comment, and has already had to re-make his libel/slander manifesto once. I've decided not to watch either one, since (a) he lacks any credibility, (b) he's just reading allegations out of a lawsuit, not the outcome of the suit, and (c) why give him any satisfaction? I was there, so I know what happened, and feel no need to disabuse him of his misstatements. For my audience, though, it's different. It kind of forces my hand in that respect, so I figured I should give them some background. You can also refer to my first book, which has a section on it. Or my Wikipedia page, which is accurate. But here goes. [Post too long, split it in 2]

"He's in Russia"...

10:31 PM

It's a shame you haven't watched the final one I've made, it is clearly disproving the negative affirmation billing claim you're making. There's 100% more to it, check out store.sharewareonline.com on waybackmachine for details. You're clear on the legal side of things, but you don't pass from a moral standpoint. Please watch the video and address it. I'm glad you have finally answered publicly, but I would want you to address a couple more claims I think are indisputable

10:32 PM

I also showed in the video the DMs from me you simply aired, so there's that. I did reach out to you

10:34 PM

You also ran SammSoft which also sold "shareware" until you decided to shut it off, there's a claim on Xeriton that jumps around chronologically during the lifetime of the landing page

10:35 PM

There's so much more stuff people still don't know, so I don't think you should be taking a sideline. I did upload the video after your message, but only because you blocked me on Twitter for some reason (edited)

10:37 PM

Lots of shady things, and you trying to cover them up. What would you do were you in my shoes?

Foxyz

it's not entirely true but I'm not gonna start an argument, I know Enderman will

I mean I'm good, I'm glad he finally answered with something. It is not satisfactory, but it's not a complete failure anymore

10:40 PM

All the points I've made are in the latest video, so there isn't much to arguing about it, unless Dave directly counters the claims or proves them true

10:41 PM

The community isn't a pack of wolves, but it would be preferrable for him to be honest, we're all adults and should take responsibility for what we've done, unless those $250K are still on hold and he violated the decree while running Sammsoft? (edited)

10:42 PM

All I see is legal speak, and I'd love him to address the rest of the stuff

10:42 PM

"He's in Russia" at the very beginning fucking killed me though

10:43 PM

That's a fatal blow right there, can't be trusted anymore

He didn't mention anything about the law in Russia intially, he might have gotten a bit upset and looked it up, then came back to edit the message.

Oh yea maybe

If that's a threat for legal action, I'm all prepared, defamation cases are instadismissed by the legal system or something? I never intended to defame Dave, I just happened not to know how to legal speak. The suspended $250K is at stake though, there's very possibly a way to prove most terms of the decree were violated during the operation of sammsoft (it ran until 2009 I think)

I doubt it's a threat for legal action

10:59 PM

he just felt like throwing some legal words back

Mhm

seems pretty common for someone to return accusations after receiving them

Oh he also wipes any comment regarding SO.com under his videos

11:08 PM

But that's just cherry on top

yeah he likely tries to keep the rumours from spreading

11:09 PM

some comments are very mean though

I wish people were more civilized

same

11:09 PM

we think we're so smart but we are more monkey than anything

Never ask a man his salary, a woman her age, and Dave what happened on April 11th of 2006

11:10 PM

but if he doesn't want to talk about it it'd mean he also isn't proud of it

or hiding something

11:12 PM

like sammsoft running in 2006-09 likely in violation of the decree

it'd be interesting to see what Sammsoft was, wasn't memturbo from softwareonline?

it was a successor of softwareonline, served everything from softwareonline

11:15 PM

Except InternetShield because term 3 of the decree prohibited promoting InternetShield at all

11:15 PM

And specifically InternetShield

oh right

Heres the dialog in one piece

11:19 PM

Not ashamed to share, because me not asking any questions is slander

Foxyz

it's not entirely true but I'm not gonna start an argument, I know Enderman will

that's what I meant by not entirely true

Oh

yeah it's the first message of the year unfortunately

Love the new video on Computer Basics. Only tip: I don't think many younger computer fans know why ROM was important before storage was part of PCs out of the box.

I wonder when Apple is gonna leave the storage out of the box

RocksterXrX

Love the new video on Computer Basics. Only tip: I don't think many younger computer fans know why ROM was important before storage was part of PCs out of the box.

i dont

11:47 PM

do new computers have rom? or nah (edited)

I wonder how many people even know ROM exists

zoii

do new computers have rom? or nah (edited)

I guess for the BIOS

only

uhm

11:48 PM

the embedded controller?

cuz the os is stored in hd so

but something needs to start the OS

11:49 PM

the CPU can't begin reading from a hard disk if it doesn't know what a hard disk is

11:50 PM

and something needs to take care of the computer's LEDs and fans

11:51 PM

or if you don't have any storage at all, on Windows you get an error screen and on MacOS a sad folder, it needs to be stored somewhere

Foxyz

but something needs to start the OS

the bios

yup

11:51 PM

I think it's stored on EEPROM?

11:52 PM

or maybe on flash nowadays

11:52 PM

if flash has a tendency to lose data over long time of being powered off, can your BIOS get corrupted over time?

and what the cmos does

keep the clock ticking

11:54 PM

and probably some other things

11:55 PM

I think even my Nokia had a CMOS battery back in the days

Foxyz

and probably some other things

like bios settings

yes exactly

davepl1968

I've been sitting on the sidelines on this one. He's in Russia, never reached out to me for comment, and has already had to re-make his libel/slander manifesto once. I've decided not to watch either one, since (a) he lacks any credibility, (b) he's just reading allegations out of a lawsuit, not the outcome of the suit, and (c) why give him any satisfaction? I was there, so I know what happened, and feel no need to disabuse him of his misstatements. For my audience, though, it's different. It kind of forces my hand in that respect, so I figured I should give them some background. You can also refer to my first book, which has a section on it. Or my Wikipedia page, which is accurate. But here goes. [Post too long, split it in 2]

No worries Dave! I have been using InternetShield for years now my Document Object Model is perfectly safe, thanks to your hard work.

1

1

3

I'm just counting rivets that I need to order to put this thing back together after I tear it down but like... How on earth were these particular rivets installed? That is just over one inch clearance

7:22 AM

These are becoming screws in the rebuild lol. I dunno where to find the world's most compact pop rivet gun for this one exact size of rivet.

7:26 AM

Oh duh rivets work the other way around, one inch shank or less fits lol

I hate rivets, screws are better

gonna mod my model m to get rid of these

5:06 PM

eventually

Foxyz

I hate rivets, screws are better

Depends on the situation but majority I agree

6:23 PM

If it might ever need to be adjusted or removed, screws

6:23 PM

If it's a permanent part, rivets

but if rivet gets wiggly, you can't tighten it properly

is there a way to boot off of my ssd in a vm? i have windows 7 on my old ssd but i can't boot from it on my current pc as it just hangs at classpnp.sys driver

7:37 PM

and i have some data to backup

What VM software are you using to boot from it? Can you try Hyper-V with Gen 1 virtual machine?

Deformisani SAS

is there a way to boot off of my ssd in a vm? i have windows 7 on my old ssd but i can't boot from it on my current pc as it just hangs at classpnp.sys driver

If it won't boot on hardware what makes you think it'll boot in a VM lol

VCSMaster

If it won't boot on hardware what makes you think it'll boot in a VM lol

why wouldn't it work?

Foxyz

What VM software are you using to boot from it? Can you try Hyper-V with Gen 1 virtual machine?

vmware 11

can you extract the data without booting into it?

Presumably the two machines are not piece for piece identical so A) you're changing all the hardware out from under it, windows is not a fan of this when it's working right B) it already has a boot problem why would VM make a difference

Foxyz

can you extract the data without booting into it?

yes but i want to boot from it in a vm

Foxyz

but if rivet gets wiggly, you can't tighten it properly

But that doesn't matter for like a hanger on a door

VCSMaster

Presumably the two machines are not piece for piece identical so A) you're changing all the hardware out from under it, windows is not a fan of this when it's working right B) it already has a boot problem why would VM make a difference

boot problem is driver related on my host machine

7:59 PM

and not on vm side presumably

Deformisani SAS

yes but i want to boot from it in a vm

right, you can try changing the boot configuration, I don't know if Windows 7 properly supports UEFI

7:59 PM

try Hyper-V with gen 1

it does support uefi properly

Foxyz

try Hyper-V with gen 1

ok i'll try hyper v

8:00 PM

a i hate this

Deformisani SAS

and not on vm side presumably

So you have a driver problem and you're going to fix it by forcing windows to reconfigure all drivers for a machine it's never seen before?

8:00 PM

While it already won't boot no less?

usually windows just works on other hardware configs it has basic drivers

8:01 PM

if it won't boot at all it might be a bios config problem

8:02 PM

or registry damage

Foxyz

usually windows just works on other hardware configs it has basic drivers

Changing from a Ryzen 5600G to a 5900X causes windows to not boot anymore on my machine. Imagine if I also changed every other piece of hardware

8:02 PM

Windows generally does not appreciate this

Foxyz

usually windows just works on other hardware configs it has basic drivers

ok so how do i use hyperv? i enabled it

Deformisani SAS

ok so how do i use hyperv? i enabled it

open hyper-v manager

i can't find it

normally if you search hyper-v in windows search it shows up

oh now it shows up

Why can't I install Hyper-V anymore in Windows 11 23H2?

it took its sweet time

Foxyz

Why can't I install Hyper-V anymore in Windows 11 23H2?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

8:04 PM

ok so i got hyper v running, what now?

normally on the left side you see your computer's name

8:05 PM

click it and on the right side click create new

okay

then follow the steps

8:05 PM

gen 1 machine

8:06 PM

and if it asks for a hard disk, choose to attach a hard disk later

8:06 PM

then we can make it boot from your physical ssd

yup

8:07 PM

after it's created click to change the settings

ok

there should be an IDE controller

i see scsi

yeah try that

yes

in vmware i tried scsi but it couldn't find the drive at all

I think you need to put the disk offline

8:08 PM

Win+X

8:08 PM

disk manager

8:09 PM

then right click your Windows 7 ssd and set to offline

i don't see a option for that

not on a partition

8:09 PM

on the left you see disk 3

oh

8:10 PM

ok so now what

uh, close the settings and try opening again

8:10 PM

it should allow you to select physical hard disk

yes

8:11 PM

i see it

okay select it and apply

8:11 PM

click ok

8:11 PM

then connect to the vm and start it

8:11 PM

hope for the best

oh right

8:11 PM

open the vm settings

ok

at the bottom I think there is a checkpoints thing

8:12 PM

just disable that

and now i try to start the vm?

yes

BOOT FAILURE: reboot and select proper boot device or insert boot media in selected boot device

oh right

8:13 PM

open the settings again

ok

look in the bios settings

8:14 PM

oh wait lemme shut down the vm

yes

and now i select ide?

but the hard drive is mounted as scsi

8:14 PM

can you put it under ide controller 0?

i'll try

8:15 PM

huh

oh yeah

8:16 PM

remove it from scsi first

i don't have the option to use it in here

8:16 PM

its grayed out even tho the drive is offline

oh right

8:17 PM

well scsi then

now i can't add it in scsi either wtf

is it offline

according to disk management it is offline

and if you set it to online, then to offline again

ok

then try adding it to ide controller 0

wait.. i now should be able to set it to ide

8:18 PM

or no..?

8:18 PM

still doesn't give the option

normally

8:18 PM

can you close the settings and open it again

ah its a bug with hyperv

yeah you gotta play with it a bit to get it to work

blinking cursor

8:19 PM

is it trying to boot from

8:20 PM

did you set boot order to ide?

yes i did

8:20 PM

okay good

ok so now what

troubleshooting

8:21 PM

do you have an iso file somewhere

8:21 PM

for installing windows

i do

8:21 PM

it's on my hard drive filled with files

can you mount it and try to boot from it first

i'll try that

Foxyz

can you mount it and try to boot from it first

then you can go into the recovery environment from the installation iso, then see if the partitions with windows 7 are visible on the vm

yeah select al anguage

8:23 PM

then on the next screen is normally a button for recovery

my iso uses the windows setup for the esd file format support btw

8:23 PM

huh what happened

8:24 PM

can you go to advanced options

8:24 PM

try getting itno a command prompt

8:24 PM

ok i'm in cmd

right

8:24 PM

open notepad or taskmgr or someting

opened notepad

then file > open

8:25 PM

you should be able to go to this pc and see the partitions that are mounted

but how come you are in Windows 10 recovery environment

Foxyz

but how come you are in Windows 10 recovery environment

custom installer

ohh right

Deformisani SAS

Click to see attachment 🖼️

I assume that's the right one

it is

it should be able to boot from it

8:26 PM

did you boot UEFI on your previous computer where the Windows 7 worked?

on real hardware it shows the windows 7 boot animation and then it hang

Foxyz

did you boot UEFI on your previous computer where the Windows 7 worked?

uhh it's mbr

right

Deformisani SAS

uhh it's mbr

so legacy bios

yeah

might be a registry

8:27 PM

registry problem

shit

you should try going to C:\Windows\System32\config

can i set the vm to use legacy bios?

and back up that entire folder

Deformisani SAS

can i set the vm to use legacy bios?

it's already doing that because we are in gen 1

oh

Foxyz

you should try going to C:\Windows\System32\config

try making a copy of this folder

i made a copy of it

and then look, normally there is a regback folder inside config

emtpy regback folder

are you sure it's empty?

yup

8:29 PM

well if it's a registry problem we can't easily solve it them

8:29 PM

does the installation still boot on the computer it was verified working on?

okay i guess i'll just copy the files from the drive and then format it into uefi

Foxyz

does the installation still boot on the computer it was verified working on?

it booted last time i had the pc where this ssd was from

Deformisani SAS

okay i guess i'll just copy the files from the drive and then format it into uefi

you shouldn't need to reformat it

how so?

it can be converted to gpt without formatting

oh

it's NTFS you're good

i thought you had to format them tho

nah

8:31 PM

but even if you're gonna convert it I always recommend making a backup of your important data, never take risks

wait hold on

8:31 PM

even the regback folder on my main ssd where windows 10 is installed is empty

bu modern Windows 10 doesn't do regback anymore

oooh

I think it was disabled in maybe 1803? I don't remember fully

so for now i'm basically fucked without the regback stuff on my old ssd right?

8:32 PM

wait

8:32 PM

what if legacy bios is the problem on why it won't boot? because my components support windows 7 fully

but what hardware did you boot your Windows 7 from originally or what was it installed on?

Deformisani SAS

what if legacy bios is the problem on why it won't boot? because my components support windows 7 fully

try in a Gen 2 hyper-v then

Foxyz

but what hardware did you boot your Windows 7 from originally or what was it installed on?

orignally it was on am2 (yes am2)

does it still boot on the original system

i don't have it

oh right

i sold it

but it booted before you sold

yes

should work then

hm

8:36 PM

i think it's legacy bios what's causing the hang on boot on real hardware

8:36 PM

because i've heard from many people that legacy bios on newer motherboards is somewhat incompatible iwth older os's

8:37 PM

so it could be that

I don't know, usually MRB and Legacy BIOS go together and GPT with UEFI

8:38 PM

With Windows 7 I usually do Legacy BIOS

i'll format my flash drive with rufus into uefi with my iso and then convert my ssd after copying the files onto a different drive

you can try making a new VM in hyper-v, set it to gen 2, do the same steps to add the hpysicial disk

and then reinstall windows on it

Deformisani SAS

i'll format my flash drive with rufus into uefi with my iso and then convert my ssd after copying the files onto a different drive

right

8:38 PM

I think disk manager lets you convert

Foxyz

I think disk manager lets you convert

i don't have a option so i have to use diskpart

8:39 PM

I can't convert to mbr on my boot disk because it's in use but I assume convert to GPT is an option too

8:39 PM

diskpart should work too yeah

okay

If you're going to reinstall you don't need to reformat, it should move the 4 main folders to Windows.old where your data remains untouched for a week, then the windows installation gets deleted and after a month the user data also gets deleted so move that data out of windows.old as soon as possible

the ssd is already gpt?

stuck at disk.sys

9:02 PM

this is so weird

yeah is it ahci mode or ide

Deformisani SAS

stuck at disk.sys

are you trying to natively boot here?

yes

9:27 PM

with uefi which made it worse because it didn't get into the second portion of the setup unlike with mbr

9:28 PM

the install on mbr finished completely, it was after the install where it hang at classpnp.sys

9:29 PM

and some people say that i should disable secure boot which i don't know if even have it enabled

seure boot you can see in bios settings

New video out! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAzEJxOo1ts&list=UUNzszbnvQeFzObW0ghk0Ckw Here is what I don't get, if anything about the driver changes, doesn't the MS certification be void? (edited)

Dave's Garage

CrowdStrike IT Outage Explained by a Windows Developer

usuallly if you do uefi boot, secure boot is enabled

Zelalem

New video out! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAzEJxOo1ts&list=UUNzszbnvQeFzObW0ghk0Ckw Here is what I don't get, if anything about the driver changes, doesn't the MS certification be void? (edited)

but the driver doesn't change

srty to bother the convo. Will start a thread for itself.

there is a separate file, the driver executes the instructions in that separate file

9:50 PM

if you go to youtube in your browser, it's always the latest version of youtube but the browser doesn't need to be updated immediately to open the updated website

Ah. kinda makes sense. MS certifies the driver, but the driver is ran using a separate file, and that file doesn;t need to be certfied again everytime it changes??

yes, the driver is signed by microsoft and runs code that is defined in a separate file, this allows crowdstrike to push changes as fast as possible

Foxyz

seure boot you can see in bios settings

disabled by default

10:51 PM

i ran into a issue foxy. i am stuck here with manual deploy

Deformisani SAS

i ran into a issue foxy. i am stuck here with manual deploy

did you format the efi drive as fat32

11:14 PM

and did you assign a letter to it via diskpart

yes

Zelalem

New video out! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAzEJxOo1ts&list=UUNzszbnvQeFzObW0ghk0Ckw Here is what I don't get, if anything about the driver changes, doesn't the MS certification be void? (edited)

Yes, but the driver doesn't change, only the "channel" files change, and those are not signed by Microsoft (as far as I know).

Zelalem

New video out! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAzEJxOo1ts&list=UUNzszbnvQeFzObW0ghk0Ckw Here is what I don't get, if anything about the driver changes, doesn't the MS certification be void? (edited)

From what I understand, the files are basically read by the driver and interpreted as code using Kernel level privileges (edited)

are those channel files signed by crowdsource? I'd assume so as it would be insecure otherwise

Lol I bet they aren't signed, or not very strong at least

5:15 AM

What a cool way to expose that you have a kernel exploit waiting

but does the channel file contain arbitrary code or can it only define execution of a series of predefined functions in the driver?

Foxyz

but does the channel file contain arbitrary code or can it only define execution of a series of predefined functions in the driver?

It can't contain arbitrary code

12:56 PM

HVCI prevents this

12:56 PM

So at most it contains a bytecode that is interpreted

12:56 PM

I have seen no evidence to support this however

It would be interesting to see exactly how it works (if there's documentation or if it's not illegal to reverse engineer)

J

It can't contain arbitrary code

yeah not actual CPU binary but I'd expect it to be a proprietary interpreted language like javascript then

1:25 PM

but compiled to some binary format to make it unreadable and compact

J

HVCI prevents this

I actually read hvci isn't as strong

3:03 PM

without cet and cfg

3:03 PM

so you can sorta bypass it if these aren't enabled

3:03 PM

but vbs is

3:03 PM

frfr

Foxyz

but does the channel file contain arbitrary code or can it only define execution of a series of predefined functions in the driver?

Surely as a kernel driver that performs security functions it A) has some pretty powerful interpreted commands B) has already been shown to take the machine down when given a bad command

rogueamp

without cet and cfg

Well if the driver is vmped

3:54 PM

You could compile your own code to rub on that vm

3:54 PM

You only need to get a kernel allocation

3:55 PM

Or a user mode one with smap disabled

Well and a kernel thread creation primitive

4:06 PM

which isnt too bad

rogueamp

I actually read hvci isn't as strong

It still prevents this from containing arbitrary code btw

4:32 PM

The kernel itsellf cannot create any RWX supervisor pages

4:32 PM

All those allocations need to go through the secure kernel which verifies the signatures of the driver code

rogueamp

but vbs is

I love VBS

4:37 PM

such a shame there isn't a proper IDE for it

VCSMaster

Surely as a kernel driver that performs security functions it A) has some pretty powerful interpreted commands B) has already been shown to take the machine down when given a bad command

yeah it should in no case take the machine down, I can't believe they didn't catch such fatal flaw during testing

Foxyz

I love VBS

its not the vb 6 script language im talking about

J

All those allocations need to go through the secure kernel which verifies the signatures of the driver code

Oh yea it doesnt really bypass hvci

6:14 PM

It just doesnt trigger it

Foxyz

yeah it should in no case take the machine down, I can't believe they didn't catch such fatal flaw during testing

InternetShield would have blocked the update

but you want updates

But I dont

7:02 PM

Disabled on every machine until operating system end of life

That's my understanding as well, that it's p-code that gets executed by a p-code engine in the driver. But I don't have any confirmation of that, just rumor and conjecture!

Can't wait for someone to reverse engineer the driver and write bad apple for it

2

7:06 PM

Speaking of unwanted updates, have we all seen that Logitech has announced a subscription model for computer mice that includes OTA firmware updates?

VCSMaster

But I dont

me neither and that's fine for a home computer that doesn't have to serve an always online super important purpose

VCSMaster

Speaking of unwanted updates, have we all seen that Logitech has announced a subscription model for computer mice that includes OTA firmware updates?

since when do mice need updates?? It either works or it doesn't work, I don't get it

Foxyz

since when do mice need updates?? It either works or it doesn't work, I don't get it

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/99658/logitech-is-working-on-forever-mouse-that-you-pay-per-month-for/index.html

Logitech is working on a 'forever mouse' that you pay per month for

Logitech has revealed its working on a 'forever mouse' in its R&D labs, and that this mouse could be so good it warrants a monthly subscription.

7:35 PM

You tell me

Foxyz

me neither and that's fine for a home computer that doesn't have to serve an always online super important purpose

Like I said I run all machines of all types with updates completely disabled until OS EOL at which point I install all of them all at once

J

InternetShield would have blocked the update

8:17 PM

The JavaScript security is safe ✅

VCSMaster

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/99658/logitech-is-working-on-forever-mouse-that-you-pay-per-month-for/index.html

wow a revolutionary mouse that lets you move the cursor and click

10:12 PM

I hope that FOREVER logo isn't on the actual product, it doesn't look very comfortable for your fingers

rogueamp

The JavaScript security is safe ✅

What the hell does that even mean

Foxyz

I hope that FOREVER logo isn't on the actual product, it doesn't look very comfortable for your fingers

I'm almost certain that image is AI. The real product will probably be much uglier

Foxyz

wow a revolutionary mouse that lets you move the cursor and click

Supposedly with upgradeable firmware and an AI button

10:18 PM

Upgradeable firmware means it will be unfinished and barely functional when it shows up, and AI means you'll accidentally bump a button and your computer will instantly waste a bunch of resources

VCSMaster

I'm almost certain that image is AI. The real product will probably be much uglier

Yeah I was indeed wondering if it was AI generated because it has a second scroll wheel

I've seen real mice with two scroll wheels

for x and y?

No

VCSMaster

Upgradeable firmware means it will be unfinished and barely functional when it shows up, and AI means you'll accidentally bump a button and your computer will instantly waste a bunch of resources

I'm so done with hearing AI this AI that

AI is super cool but come on

VCSMaster

Click to see attachment 🖼️

what the hell

10:23 PM

that's ridiculous

That's the one I'm aware of

4D+

They're kinda rare so I don't own one but I have seen one in person

10:24 PM

Would love to have one though especially in that goofy box

10:24 PM

Surf the net faster with 2 wheels

yeah

10:24 PM

totally not just making it weird so people buy it

Foxyz

I'm so done with hearing AI this AI that

I don't mind hearing about it but I wish corporations would stop shoving it up my bum at this point

10:26 PM

Nothing they release does anything useful or unique

10:26 PM

If I wanted 4 copies of chatgpt I would just open multiple tabs

10:26 PM

It's use is so occasional that I have no reason to need a key on my keyboard or a shortcut or even an icon on my desktop

10:27 PM

Sometimes I forget my login because it's been weeks since I actually bothered to use it

10:28 PM

It's a new thing and it's become a buzzword so that means every "yes fellow consumers" company has to put it out there

Nvidia had made some very promising papers for AI steered player movement and stuff, I hope to see it in games

10:30 PM

well if it doesn't make the games 200GB larger, modern games are huge enough already

Why would I want AI to play the game for me

10:50 PM

I don't remember who it was that said it but "why would I want my computer to do the painting and roleplaying for me? I want it to do my work"

based

1:57 AM

tune out on 90% of the topics I hear about AI

1:57 AM

has applications but def think its been kinda overblown for the average person

VCSMaster

Why would I want AI to play the game for me

no, the player controls where the caracter goes, but the character has to balance itself and move in a natural way to follow the player's instrucitons

Hey does Dave do contests and run them out of a telegram @thedavesgarage?

12:44 AM

Or is that a scammer?

randomevenings

Hey does Dave do contests and run them out of a telegram @thedavesgarage?

I'm not aware of Dave having a telegram. Can you advise where you found this contest?

Someone on YouTube is reaching out to people as Dave and making them think they have won a contest, but then driving then to pay to have the prize shipped. It's supposed to be a MacBook pro and other stuff as something he's doing for his viewers. I believe it's a scammer

randomevenings

Someone on YouTube is reaching out to people as Dave and making them think they have won a contest, but then driving then to pay to have the prize shipped. It's supposed to be a MacBook pro and other stuff as something he's doing for his viewers. I believe it's a scammer

it is

And I think a lot of people are going to fall for it

randomevenings

And I think a lot of people are going to fall for it

sadly

randomevenings

Someone on YouTube is reaching out to people as Dave and making them think they have won a contest, but then driving then to pay to have the prize shipped. It's supposed to be a MacBook pro and other stuff as something he's doing for his viewers. I believe it's a scammer

That would definitely be a scam.

like the bitcoin live stream: send an amount & you'll receive the double

Yep thought so

fendibull

Like i said. The nature of those business practice was normal on 2000s. Especially before 2008. It's a proprietary software with shareware attitude. If it released on 2018? Yes it's a scam but things were different back then. The problem with people generally they expect the old software would run the same on contemporary

And yet nowadays it's totally normal if software from an "app store" is loaded with ads.

4:53 AM

Enderman wants to dump on Dave for the crapware company he was with for a brief period, yet Microsoft themselves was once pushing things like Bing Bar in unrelated installers like the DirectX Runtimes.

By the way I sent @davepl1968 a DM. That coming from a frequent user of Task Manager.

randomevenings

Hey does Dave do contests and run them out of a telegram @thedavesgarage?

Sounds like a scam

6:29 AM

Maybe we can put up a message in a channel here with Dave's official accounts so if someone contacts a member with an account not listed there it's a scam

BFeely

And yet nowadays it's totally normal if software from an "app store" is loaded with ads.

iOS is also loaded with ads, people might not realise it as it's engineered in a way to seem subtle

6:30 AM

once you realise it you can't unsee it anymore

6:31 AM

when you get an iPhone you're kind of forced to put an Apple ID on it, and once you do, iCloud Photos is enabled by default, which results in your purposefully small 5GB iCloud storage getting full quickly, and if that happens you receive notifications from the built in settings app to tell you to buy more storage

6:32 AM

it's very cleverly designed to get people to pay for iCloud

BFeely

By the way I sent @davepl1968 a DM. That coming from a frequent user of Task Manager.

I don't know how frequently he checks his Discord, usually it's better to send him an email.

Interesting, I didn't think of that

Original message was deleted or could not be loaded.

The chances of me responding to a troll who's primarily a Russian pirate are slim. And I'm not going to copyright strike him. I just archived the two versions, haven't watched them, but have had others do so, and they were blown away with the risks he's taking. I haven't even raised it to my YouTube rep. They The statute of limitations in Russia for civil slander is 3 years and generally 2 years for criminal, which is what would apply here I'm told. But am I going to sue some kid in Russia? What would the point be? All the law requires there for a conviction is dissemination of inaccurate discrediting information about an individual. It'd take me about 20 minutes and $500 to have some lawyer in Kulag start the process against Andy, but to what end? Even if he takes it down, 50K people have already been misled, you can't undo that. And if I squeezed out some judgement for a couple of hundred K all I get is a piece of paper for it. Sometimes the only way to win is not to play the game. He just didn't see that movie, because it was made before he was born. (edited)

Could the video fall under harassment which is a Community Guidelines rule not requiring legal action? Also, his GitHub says Australia; is he working around TOS on GitHub in light of the war? (at least here in the USA we can legally call it a war unlike heavily censored Russia). (edited)

7:35 PM

That said I did suggest years ago in a YouTube comment you do a post-mortem on SoftwareOnline quite a while ago when I first saw the Wikipedia article. (edited)

7:37 PM

I'm guessing his piracy site uses Cloudflare by the way due to them being the only US-based reverse proxy service that allows such behavior. Also, Cloudflare still happily does business in Russia, even aiding dangerous Russian government agencies. (edited)

7:38 PM

I never noticed your crapware back in the day, but it was just lost in the sea of crapware, such as download managers with malicious adware, that flooded the markets in the day.

7:41 PM

Did you ever clear things up with major YouTuber Barnacules Nerdgasm? But then he does seem to be a bit of a disgruntled former employee where you appeared to have left under a more positive note. (edited)

I agree that taking legal action over a silly argument like this is a little much, it'd be better to calm down and no more accusations.

7:42 PM

It'd be much nicer if both Dave and Enderman just stopped

Foxyz

It'd be much nicer if both Dave and Enderman just stopped

If in fact Enderman does his videos for profit, there may be money laundering going on to get his profits into Russia, as my understanding is that YouTube has halted all monetization in Russia.

nah I don't think so

7:44 PM

Enderman just wants to know if Dave unfairly earned millions

The only "crapware" I'm aware of is CPURocket, which I don't actually remember - I think it was a freeware product that the company produced that adjusted the priority of the foreground window for better response at the cost of background apps. So wherever your mouse focus went, it would find that process and bump the priority temporarily while it had input focus. It was free, and Gator licensed it to use it as a "lure" for their advertising platform. In retrospect, being involved with ANY of the ad networks from circa Y2K isn't the best choice I ever made, and I do regret that... but it was "how things got done in 2002," I guess. HyperCache, Memturbo, ClipTrakker, etc, were all good apps that I wrote the initial versions of for myself. After all, you had 30 days to try them out before buying, fully functional. And then another 30 days for a full refund if you changed your mind. And 800 number toll free support, too. Even Registry Cleaner was real - though I didn't write it - and was inspired by Microsoft's own Registry Cleaner. It would do the basics of cleaning up dead entries to non-existent DLLs, registry sections, and so on. It would also repair registry entries that were required for booting, like the shell= line of explorer, so if your default shell got broken, it could fix that and so on. At the end of the day it was just a registry cleaner, but debloating the registry isn't a terrible idea. How much value is in it varies by user, how old the machine and OS is, etc. To be completely candid, I used to run it all the time, but haven't bothered in the last 10-15 years, as everything is "fast enough" these days.

7:50 PM

Oh yeah, I forgot about Internet Shield. From what I remember, that was an app that required IE. It would automatically split your internet into three zones (safe, regular, untrusted). And then it would filter sites into those based on definitions. And you could move your bank into the safe zone, then make the safe zone the only one that had scripting enabled, and so on. Not something you'd do today, but back then scripting wasn't required by every site in the world as it pretty much is today. The "problem" is Internet Shield is that the scan that probed sites didn't know if you had already protected yourself by pointing them to bogus IPs in your etc/hosts file. It just checked things like "are popups and scripting enabled on p*rnhub.com", and so on. That was what the AG complained about, anyway. While I'd wager the number of people that had hand-crafted etc/hosts files was pretty small, we had to concede that one! (edited)

davepl1968

The only "crapware" I'm aware of is CPURocket, which I don't actually remember - I think it was a freeware product that the company produced that adjusted the priority of the foreground window for better response at the cost of background apps. So wherever your mouse focus went, it would find that process and bump the priority temporarily while it had input focus. It was free, and Gator licensed it to use it as a "lure" for their advertising platform. In retrospect, being involved with ANY of the ad networks from circa Y2K isn't the best choice I ever made, and I do regret that... but it was "how things got done in 2002," I guess. HyperCache, Memturbo, ClipTrakker, etc, were all good apps that I wrote the initial versions of for myself. After all, you had 30 days to try them out before buying, fully functional. And then another 30 days for a full refund if you changed your mind. And 800 number toll free support, too. Even Registry Cleaner was real - though I didn't write it - and was inspired by Microsoft's own Registry Cleaner. It would do the basics of cleaning up dead entries to non-existent DLLs, registry sections, and so on. It would also repair registry entries that were required for booting, like the shell= line of explorer, so if your default shell got broken, it could fix that and so on. At the end of the day it was just a registry cleaner, but debloating the registry isn't a terrible idea. How much value is in it varies by user, how old the machine and OS is, etc. To be completely candid, I used to run it all the time, but haven't bothered in the last 10-15 years, as everything is "fast enough" these days.

Some of us still bump up process priority; I do so to Cinebench R23 to work around the bloat in my Windows installation and give as much CPU as possible to burn with Cinebench and as few interrupts to do other, less CPU-burning tasks, as practical. Of course I've learned my lesson about "Real time" priority a long time ago.

7:53 PM

Of course nowadays with a 24-core 13900K I just let the Windows 11 Game Mode and scheduler decide for me.

I'm pretty sure Windows does it for you these day automatically, and bumps the input process's effective priority. So I could say "Hey look, a product so bad that Microsoft copied it!" but I won't

Windows 10/11 Game Mode is like priority boost on steroids. Probably also tells various built-in background processes to go to sleep or drop their priority to Low.

Also I think the time quantum given to the foreground process is actually longer, which is different.

Also flips the power plan to High Performance.

Enderman already knows that any real money I earned from the company came from its ultimate sale. That sale was several years AFTER the lawsuit and AFTER a full and complete audit before the sale by the AG. The AG had complete access to every email, memo, ad, source code, etc, and found no issues. And clearly Support.com wouldn't have bought the company and paid for it otherwise! Between the lawsuit and the sale, we also had a full federal tax audit AND a state tax audit and I was personally audited too. All came back clean. I also had a colonoscopy that year, and it was good too. If there was even a HINT of anything, the AG would have clawed back their suspended portion. They didn't. The assistant AG that ran the case was very aggressive and very talented, so he should accept her conclusions and move on, I figure. (edited)

BFeely

Some of us still bump up process priority; I do so to Cinebench R23 to work around the bloat in my Windows installation and give as much CPU as possible to burn with Cinebench and as few interrupts to do other, less CPU-burning tasks, as practical. Of course I've learned my lesson about "Real time" priority a long time ago.

Did you tried the windows install trick for skipping a lot of bloat where you select "English (world) " as the installation language? it´s not magical but helps a bit.

I'm talking about all the stuff I've installed. I have 25 icons in my tray.

davepl1968

Enderman already knows that any real money I earned from the company came from its ultimate sale. That sale was several years AFTER the lawsuit and AFTER a full and complete audit before the sale by the AG. The AG had complete access to every email, memo, ad, source code, etc, and found no issues. And clearly Support.com wouldn't have bought the company and paid for it otherwise! Between the lawsuit and the sale, we also had a full federal tax audit AND a state tax audit and I was personally audited too. All came back clean. I also had a colonoscopy that year, and it was good too. If there was even a HINT of anything, the AG would have clawed back their suspended portion. They didn't. The assistant AG that ran the case was very aggressive and very talented, so he should accept her conclusions and move on, I figure. (edited)

I don't think he'll ever forgive you because you helped make Product Activation. My biggest concern when Windows XP came out was if the activation data was at risk of destruction by a virus. Perhaps that's why the VL version didn't have activation, especially in light of 9/11 and resulting security concerns.

I doubt it's about product activation, I mean someone had to make it, you cannot be mad about anti piracy techniques

8:34 PM

it's about the money

If you're upset about antipiracy measures, direct your anger towards the pirates

8:43 PM

Sadly, DRM is very much a defensive measure, not offense.

And yet people go nuts about Denuvo on Steam games yet in practice it is some of the least intrusive, authenticating automatically using data provided by the Steam service.

8:52 PM

And it is even surprisingly friendly to modding (except for when that UE anti-mod DRM ends up in the wild).

Hello, glad to be here

hi

BFeely

Could the video fall under harassment which is a Community Guidelines rule not requiring legal action? Also, his GitHub says Australia; is he working around TOS on GitHub in light of the war? (at least here in the USA we can legally call it a war unlike heavily censored Russia). (edited)

Reading a court case is nnot harassment

How about when you are encouraging people to hassle Dave over the case long after the settlement?

He didnt

J

He didnt

And yet Dave's mention that he's a pirate is still true as his site has pirated software.

Okay so what

12:14 AM

Then the rights holders can go sue him

12:14 AM

. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

davepl1968

Oh yeah, I forgot about Internet Shield. From what I remember, that was an app that required IE. It would automatically split your internet into three zones (safe, regular, untrusted). And then it would filter sites into those based on definitions. And you could move your bank into the safe zone, then make the safe zone the only one that had scripting enabled, and so on. Not something you'd do today, but back then scripting wasn't required by every site in the world as it pretty much is today. The "problem" is Internet Shield is that the scan that probed sites didn't know if you had already protected yourself by pointing them to bogus IPs in your etc/hosts file. It just checked things like "are popups and scripting enabled on p*rnhub.com", and so on. That was what the AG complained about, anyway. While I'd wager the number of people that had hand-crafted etc/hosts files was pretty small, we had to concede that one! (edited)

that "problem" is only a small part of the findings of fact

12:16 AM

womp womp

12:17 AM

There are 3 additional sections beyond this one that find issue with InternetShield btw

12:17 AM

SAD!

when I used clip tracker it's made my printer print every time I boot it up Windows

J

womp womp

Are you by any chance from the Enderman channel? (edited)

BFeely

Are you by any chance from the Enderman channel? (edited)

This is literally taken from the publicly available court case

12:43 AM

get over yourself

Enderman is one of my favorite YouTubers in addition to Dave I was just upset becaause I had to unplug my printer because I downloaded and used clip tracker

12:46 AM

I don't hold a grudge about the past

Hello

Toad

Hello

Heya!

how is the people

So my case restoration hit some metal fatigue lol Pretty sure I can get away with 3D printing this particular tiny bracket but it feels bad.

2:03 AM

Gonna have to do some extra perimeters if I want an ABS plastic bracket to work with a pop rivet

2:04 AM

If not, well I have a shard of aluminum to solve that problem, but I will have to order longer rivets womp womp

J

This is literally taken from the publicly available court case

Did you even care years ago?

Does that matter?

2:11 AM

Dave did these things whether or not I care

J

Does that matter?

Why hold a grudge if it was settled 18 years ago?

I dont hold a grudge

Then what's your point?

My point was that he was lying in his statement

J

My point was that he was lying in his statement

It sounds like you were told by Enderman to come be a bully. Maybe he settled the case since it was cheaper to agree to a settlement than to fight it?

2:16 AM

I'm not a lawyer, Enderman is DEFINITELY not a lawyer, and I'm sure you aren't one either.

~~It wasnt settled~~ (edited)

2:16 AM

there is a judgement

2:16 AM

I suggest you read it

That's how settlements work in the USA; the parties agree on a judgment. (edited)

Well read the findings of fact in there

2:18 AM

Dave's business dealings were slimy as fuck

You obviously have an agenda.

Read it

2:19 AM

And come to your own conclusions

There were "findings of fact" in the Yuzu case too and that was something that never went to trial.

His website is available on the wayback machine

2:22 AM

and most of his software is archived

2:22 AM

He did those things lol

You've only been on this Discord since Enderman decided to name and shame.

I was interested to see if dave would respond here

You weren't interested until the Russian pirate went after him.

@BFeely We aren't going to ban/kick someone just because they're from another youtuber's channel/discord

2:24 AM

Anyone that joins will be actioned becaused on their behavior on the server

It's a very difficult position to be in as a moderator tbh

2:25 AM

I hope eventually everyone can be on good terms with each other

But it seems some have been conditioned to be judge, jury, and executioner.

2:26 AM

I give the Yuzu case because @vmprotect may not know how civil settlements work.

BFeely

I give the Yuzu case because @vmprotect may not know how civil settlements work.

They appear to have left. Please don't abuse mod ping in the future or you will be timed out. It's best to disengage and ping one or more mods privately for drama between members.

rcmaehl

They appear to have left. Please don't abuse mod ping in the future or you will be timed out. It's best to disengage and ping one or more mods privately for drama between members.

I removed/edited the offending posts.

BFeely

I removed/edited the offending posts.

Thank ya

2

1

Hey @davepl1968, I just saw one of the Videos on the PDP on YouTube. My wife's Father was one of the Field Service guys at DEC for 30 years. If you'd like a VAX or DEC mug I'd be happy to send you one. I have an absolute ton of stuff from when he passed. Shoot me a direct message on here if you'd like.

davepl1968

The chances of me responding to a troll who's primarily a Russian pirate are slim. And I'm not going to copyright strike him. I just archived the two versions, haven't watched them, but have had others do so, and they were blown away with the risks he's taking. I haven't even raised it to my YouTube rep. They The statute of limitations in Russia for civil slander is 3 years and generally 2 years for criminal, which is what would apply here I'm told. But am I going to sue some kid in Russia? What would the point be? All the law requires there for a conviction is dissemination of inaccurate discrediting information about an individual. It'd take me about 20 minutes and $500 to have some lawyer in Kulag start the process against Andy, but to what end? Even if he takes it down, 50K people have already been misled, you can't undo that. And if I squeezed out some judgement for a couple of hundred K all I get is a piece of paper for it. Sometimes the only way to win is not to play the game. He just didn't see that movie, because it was made before he was born. (edited)

you seem to keep indirectly responding to a russian pirate while adding you don't care to respond every single time, and that response is yet another shot in the air

9:03 AM

you should probably watch the video if you want to address it like a man

9:03 AM

else one of these bullets is gonna hit you eventually

9:05 AM

spent over an hour in legal speak with xenophobic inserts instead of watching a half an hour video and addressing everything there

calling someone Russian is xenophobic?

md5oogle/takeiteasy

calling someone Russian is xenophobic?

he's done this twice and the context implies that's a bad thing

uhh, ok....

Original message was deleted or could not be loaded.

that remark is bannable by discord, and it takes the server down along with the message author (edited)

9:17 AM

so you probably want to get rid of it asap

9:18 AM

it's easy to show dave is complicit in this if he didn't ban the member for that

lol

9:20 AM

ok bud

md5oogle/takeiteasy

ok bud

is there anything you’d like to tell us?

yea, i just block trolls, cheers

trolls? no one was speaking to you, you stepped in and started acting doubtful of the point he made which seemed clear, which is why I was asking if you had anything to say

rogueamp

he's done this twice and the context implies that's a bad thing

I don't think it's implied so much as the expectation is that you already know it's a bad thing

3:21 PM

Quit breaking international law (edited)

VCSMaster

I don't think it's implied so much as the expectation is that you already know it's a bad thing

i should be sorry for being russian?

VCSMaster

Quit breaking international law (edited)

dave is trolling, there is no case

3:25 PM

I have a better case in hate speech and harassment against him already

3:26 PM

it seems i did hit the nerve and he can't stop thinking about it, but he just buries himself deeper and keeps doubling down on what should have been a spit and forget

3:28 PM

he wasn't losing from addressing it, but the background is ultimately being built up where he's not only ignoring it on purpose, he's also pissing his pants and directly threatening legal action claiming "misinformation" without watching the video (he watched both, but his ego doesn't allow him to admit it) (edited)

3:29 PM

seems like a bare king situation to me

3:29 PM

shit keeps the grandpa at night

Howdy, folks. Love the show. The DOS and Windows history, PDP-11 stuff, are amazing. Thanks, Dave. And remember not to feed the trolls.

rogueamp

spent over an hour in legal speak with xenophobic inserts instead of watching a half an hour video and addressing everything there

We are in the USA; Russia is under sanctions. Legal speak is because he cannot do anything that compromises the settlement agreement. But yes I did get warned by moderators, but that was for a different reason for which I had already addressed.

yea the USA is kind of no longer holding the world in their hands so these sanctions don't really mean anything asides from regulating outbound relations and affecting the US politics (edited)

5:24 PM

but I guess you're right that this could be a problem in international law whatever

I feel like if this guy was any more obviously a troll he'd probably live under a bridge

VCSMaster

I feel like if this guy was any more obviously a troll he'd probably live under a bridge

???

What's the question

why do you insist on calling him a troll after he responded and where did that come from

5:54 PM

actually i’d like to know why everyone else insists on calling him a troll too

People are outing him as a troll because he made a video full of lies and inaccuracies, had to retract it and take it down, made another that's just fewer of the same mistakes, he's a pirate, he steals software, he didn't display any journalism, it as 20 years ago, the state already dealt with it, the fine was paid, and I operated the business in good faith for years afterwards. If I made a video about anti-gravity and then had to take it down because it was BS and then I made another, would you watch? It's like that.

you never responded to any of the claims he made in the video though, and you "outed" him as a troll first not people, then after that your fans started calling him a troll, if you can even call it outing because it's just name-calling without further elaborating

6:21 PM

and i don't see how "he's a pirate, he steals software" is relevant, whatever that even refers to

6:22 PM

if the video really is full of lies and inaccuracies you should tell us about those to clarify

6:25 PM

also he could've not taken it down for more views if the sole purpose was to target you and make a profit off of it or what you think his motive behind the video was, he stated that he took it down so he could reiterate on those inaccuracies, one of which was when he said something along the lines of memory fragmentation isn't real

6:25 PM

if anything he wanted to make sure he wasn't saying bs

6:27 PM

legally the whole situation has been taken care of but the point of the video and the tweets was to shed light on the "scummy" practices that you did 20 years ago and were never addressed till now (edited)

davepl1968

People are outing him as a troll because he made a video full of lies and inaccuracies, had to retract it and take it down, made another that's just fewer of the same mistakes, he's a pirate, he steals software, he didn't display any journalism, it as 20 years ago, the state already dealt with it, the fine was paid, and I operated the business in good faith for years afterwards. If I made a video about anti-gravity and then had to take it down because it was BS and then I made another, would you watch? It's like that.

At least im not a scammer

6:28 PM

Your echo chamber calls me a troll, its okay if it does

This is extremely uncomfortable to read every day tbh

6:29 PM

ignoring the situation for a minute, it's just not pleasant

6:29 PM

I don't want to prevent anyone from stating what they believe, and I'm not going to really engage with the issue, but I just wanted to express my perspective as a bystander

I guess thats because dave decided to respond here instead of somewhere else

as uncomfortable as it is to read from both "sides" i really believe this would all end if dave just made a proper, full response addressing everything instead of throwing out these statements that basically don't really mean anything (edited)

Honestly what I want most of all is you two to talk one on one somehow and work stuff out :/

6:31 PM

It's just.. really uncomfortable

I know, I've been reading

6:31 PM

I just wish it'd happen

Oh how I wish that would happen

I joined originally because of my interest in software engineering, and because I wanted to be able to talk with other people about it But ever since this has happened I've just not been comfortable enough to

6:33 PM

I'm not super active to begin with

At least you're a bystander and aren't the party of a drama

I guess, but I really don't want to lose this server because of it

I'm already tired of this trash too

6:34 PM

I guess im just gonna not speak anymore, he never directly speaks to me anyway

6:35 PM

So no use

If there's a way you two can just talk to each other, I think everyone would feel a lot better tbh

6:36 PM

If not, then tbh I think it might just be better to have everyone make their points and statements and then leave it be

Right

6:37 PM

Im open anytime

Well we'll see how things go ig idk about everyone else but I'm going to go take a walk and just think about something else

1

did I walk into something ? >.>

Watched the video. Interesting, but kind of over the top. I don't find it super relevant to the work going on today with the channel. My opinion is that you can make a mistake, settle with the state, and it should not hang over your head for the rest of your life. It's much more important to learn from your mistakes and not let them define you. It is a reminder of why I stopped using windows and most windows software decades ago, though (with apologies to any current or former windows engineers)

1

7:52 PM

I also don't believe in the "what else are they hiding?" logic pervasive in the video. That just sounds like innuendo, and invasive (edited)

1

Anyway, I got a new floppy drive for my tandy 1000rl that I need to install.

wipet

actually i’d like to know why everyone else insists on calling him a troll too

Because he's sitting here directly trying to cause an argument and it's apparently working on you

indyjoenz

Watched the video. Interesting, but kind of over the top. I don't find it super relevant to the work going on today with the channel. My opinion is that you can make a mistake, settle with the state, and it should not hang over your head for the rest of your life. It's much more important to learn from your mistakes and not let them define you. It is a reminder of why I stopped using windows and most windows software decades ago, though (with apologies to any current or former windows engineers)

He's really sensationalist about it. The original description even starts with "can we make it to 20k likes"

VCSMaster

Because he's sitting here directly trying to cause an argument and it's apparently working on you

i wonder why he's trying to cause an argument

VCSMaster

He's really sensationalist about it. The original description even starts with "can we make it to 20k likes"

terrible

wipet

i wonder why he's trying to cause an argument

We have a word for that! It's called trolling.

Maybe it's because dave scammed the elderly i don't know tho

8:14 PM

VCSMaster

He's really sensationalist about it. The original description even starts with "can we make it to 20k likes"

every description on my channel is like this

8:15 PM

what am i supposed to do

wipet

Maybe it's because dave scammed the elderly i don't know tho

If you're that upset about a video from an untrustworthy source, it might be best for you to leave and go be mad about it where people might actually care.

8:16 PM

The rest of us have enough brain cells to stop and think for a couple seconds at a time

you're projecting i'm not upset lol

"us"

wipet

you're projecting i'm not upset lol

How is this projection? You typed an essay in the last couple hours since I left.

i was merely defending andrew that doesn't mean i am full of rage and trying my best to cope

8:17 PM

"us"

Who is Andrew?

@rogueamp

What does he have to do with this

???

That's just some random dude

okay

right

I'm talking about the slander that is actively happening to the owner of the server, I don't know what you're on about

@VCSMaster I think @rogueamp is the dude who made the video

Huh

8:19 PM

Didn't know that

i think it's pretty obvious since the start

Surprised he's in here and allowed to be in here lol

8:20 PM

Has he said anything?

i am also surprised considering how dave has been responding lately

8:20 PM

i'm sure he's the type to ban that russian pirate immediately

I know I would have

1

8:20 PM

Probably would have been the best decision

8:20 PM

Though obviously I am not Dave and I can't speak on his behalf

⭕

8:22 PM

(he's not answering directly to me)

8:22 PM

(

)

honestly i'm getting tired of this going nowhere

I assume rogueamp is Andy who made the video. Or a suitable proxy thereof. I haven't kicked or banned anyone yet, but will start to enforce the basic rules. If you've got a genuine question, ask it directly. Other nonsense can be done elsewhere, I don't need to support it on my own Discord. You've had your time to play. (edited)

https://discord.com/channels/894370776101302293/894370776101302296/1270056602921205853

rogueamp

https://discord.com/channels/894370776101302293/894370776101302296/1270056602921205853

Wasn't that supposed to be private?

nah, he's saying i didn't ask anything

8:25 PM

not private anymore

I'm not going to comment on the private message I sent you. I think the decision to post it publicly is just another reveal into your character.

still not responding to any claims btw

davepl1968

I'm not going to comment on the private message I sent you. I think the decision to post it publicly is just another reveal into your character.

For one, I think you should give the video a go

LotP

honestly i'm getting tired of this going nowhere

Agreed

That will explain a lot why I don't like your way of communicating

And hey Dave good to see you here again

And second of all, it's just all left on read purposefully, so it's only natural for it to become public

i'm just confused why this is still a thing the case was finished and settled, and it wasn't even an uncommon situation back then the internet was still new, and rules were still being written

VCSMaster

And hey Dave good to see you here again

I've already responded. To those who are not satisfied, you'lll either have to (a) learn to cope with this 20 year old tragedy, or (b) ask a followup question in a polite manner and get a response.

LotP

i'm just confused why this is still a thing the case was finished and settled, and it wasn't even an uncommon situation back then the internet was still new, and rules were still being written

Idk man but there are a bunch of people who really want to start some drama and at this point I'm just blocking them lol

2

8:29 PM

Rather than play chess with pigeons I'm just going to do something else

you actually haven't addressed the part where you tricked a bunch of grandmas into thinking their Document Object Model was infected

Have you stopped beating your dog?

I think I might have mentioned it the other day but I got a really good deal on an Atari Jaguar CD addon and I'm pretty happy with that

i'm gonna start handing out timeouts to people who don't act respectfully, or just add nothing of value to the server by brining up this drama for the sake of drama

davepl1968

I've already responded. To those who are not satisfied, you'lll either have to (a) learn to cope with this 20 year old tragedy, or (b) ask a followup question in a polite manner and get a response.

Watch the video, a lot of open questions there, please address those. They're all in a polite manner. This is the reason I remade my original video, I try to be objective

8:30 PM

It's a pretty neat unit, but Atari should have gone with the CD to begin with instead of carts

davepl1968

Have you stopped beating your dog?

what does this mean

There's zero chance I'm waiting the videos. I had my attorney snapshot them both and he recommended there was no point in doing so.

Just weird that they bothered to make an addon for a console that wasn't hardly selling lol

this arrived a few days ago very cool, fully metal too it has ~15 song from the Tears of the Kingdom OST on it

Oh that's sweet

davepl1968

There's zero chance I'm waiting the videos. I had my attorney snapshot them both and he recommended there was no point in doing so.

You're still a person Dave, not a corporation to try and slide this in. Your behavior is pretty condescending from the very start

Does the sword come out ?

VCSMaster

Does the sword come out ?

yeee, it's a usb stick

8:31 PM

rogueamp

You're still a person Dave, not a corporation to try and slide this in. Your behavior is pretty condescending from the very start

Did you read the word attorney? Since you are beating at that legal case, it's not a good idea to respond without legal counsel.

Legally you'll be safe, but your public reputation will be damaged if you don't respond

I don't owe you or anyone else anything. You understand that, right? You can throw rocks at my greenhouse but it still makes you a vandal.

rogueamp

Legally you'll be safe, but your public reputation will be damaged if you don't respond

Sounds like you personally are attacking his public reputation, while he continues to gain subscribers on YouTube anyway.

I've already responded, here and on Twitter. That's all you're going to get unless you ask specific questions that actually merit a response.

LotP

yeee, it's a usb stick

That's even cooler lol

we actually did ask specific questions but you responded with "Have you stopped beating your dog?"

Should have made the stone a hub though

8:33 PM

Change your windows plug in sound to the master sword noise

Well, there's my response too. If you don't respond in an honest and complete manner, the video is remaining on YouTube. I'm just saying your public image will be damaged by this if you don't

rogueamp i'd suggest maybe getting some legal council on the actions you're currently taking while Dave might've been in a legal case like you say, what you're doing right now is making an easy case for defamation too

rogueamp

Well, there's my response too. If you don't respond in an honest and complete manner, the video is remaining on YouTube. I'm just saying your public image will be damaged by this if you don't

Sounds like blackmail.

Your InternetShield and RegistryCleaner memories are wrong, and I review the software in video too

VCSMaster

Change your windows plug in sound to the master sword noise

damn, good idea

BFeely

Sounds like blackmail.

Well, it isn't blackmail. I just reviewed the court documents and think this is horrible, so I put this out on YouTube. Nothing wrong with that (edited)

LotP

rogueamp i'd suggest maybe getting some legal council on the actions you're currently taking while Dave might've been in a legal case like you say, what you're doing right now is making an easy case for defamation too

Unfortunately I agree. It's not going to lead anywhere positive for anyone, it would probably be best to just drop it

8:34 PM

I hate to say it again but this really seems like he just wants to mooch off of Dave's fanbase for his own subs lol

LotP

rogueamp i'd suggest maybe getting some legal council on the actions you're currently taking while Dave might've been in a legal case like you say, what you're doing right now is making an easy case for defamation too

I don't care for legal stuff, I just want him to let people know what happened, this would make a great episode. Hiding this will only make people turn on him

YouTube drama sucks

Well I finished my walk, and I've read what's been happening Gonna be honest I really think everyone should just make their statements and let it lie What good is going to come of escalating things?

I got an in box 5200 too. With working controllers, no less!

rogueamp

I don't care for legal stuff, I just want him to let people know what happened, this would make a great episode. Hiding this will only make people turn on him

You are discussing a legal case, and that requires legal counsel. You aren't a lawyer, and since Dave is not a lawyer he seeks legal advice.

Even the rubber boots on the joysticks are still in good shape.

rogueamp

I don't care for legal stuff, I just want him to let people know what happened, this would make a great episode. Hiding this will only make people turn on him

that is the stupidest thing i have read in a while you're talking about someone doing bad stuff and getting pulled into court over it, and now you're also doing stupid shit that could end up with you in court...

Now I gotta find a VCS adapter for it. My dad wants his 2600 back lol

LotP

that is the stupidest thing i have read in a while you're talking about someone doing bad stuff and getting pulled into court over it, and now you're also doing stupid shit that could end up with you in court...

I don't care if I get pulled in court for this, I swear

Had you asked a reasonable set of questions in advance, you'd know why you video is bullshit. You didn't take the time, you just read the discovery and claims from the AG suit without any regard to what was proved. You used words like felon, scam, and grandmas. Aside from the obvious criminal, civil, and other issues your videos have triggered, there's the Community Standards for YouTube itself. Don't you think this video represents cyberbullying or harassment? I think you're already two strikes in for piracy or whatever, so it seems a risky choice. I'm not even sure how you can operate a for-profit YouTube channel under current sanctions, to be honest. Kangaroos in Kulag would be weird.

I just say scamming people is horrible and that part of his story must be clear to everyone

davepl1968

Had you asked a reasonable set of questions in advance, you'd know why you video is bullshit. You didn't take the time, you just read the discovery and claims from the AG suit without any regard to what was proved. You used words like felon, scam, and grandmas. Aside from the obvious criminal, civil, and other issues your videos have triggered, there's the Community Standards for YouTube itself. Don't you think this video represents cyberbullying or harassment? I think you're already two strikes in for piracy or whatever, so it seems a risky choice. I'm not even sure how you can operate a for-profit YouTube channel under current sanctions, to be honest. Kangaroos in Kulag would be weird.

And at least one of those strikes is from YouTube and not even a DMCA claim.

davepl1968

Had you asked a reasonable set of questions in advance, you'd know why you video is bullshit. You didn't take the time, you just read the discovery and claims from the AG suit without any regard to what was proved. You used words like felon, scam, and grandmas. Aside from the obvious criminal, civil, and other issues your videos have triggered, there's the Community Standards for YouTube itself. Don't you think this video represents cyberbullying or harassment? I think you're already two strikes in for piracy or whatever, so it seems a risky choice. I'm not even sure how you can operate a for-profit YouTube channel under current sanctions, to be honest. Kangaroos in Kulag would be weird.

I see the claims and prove them in real time by downloading the software you have served

8:38 PM

Also speaking of sanctions they don't matter in the modern world, the US lost its grip

Anyone remember the ActionMax lol

My software works great, and you know that. CPURocket was free. So what's your point?

Game console that works on VHS tapes

davepl1968

My software works great, and you know that. CPURocket was free. So what's your point?

It served adware that wasn't uninstalled after

davepl1968

Had you asked a reasonable set of questions in advance, you'd know why you video is bullshit. You didn't take the time, you just read the discovery and claims from the AG suit without any regard to what was proved. You used words like felon, scam, and grandmas. Aside from the obvious criminal, civil, and other issues your videos have triggered, there's the Community Standards for YouTube itself. Don't you think this video represents cyberbullying or harassment? I think you're already two strikes in for piracy or whatever, so it seems a risky choice. I'm not even sure how you can operate a for-profit YouTube channel under current sanctions, to be honest. Kangaroos in Kulag would be weird.

it's really something to be accused of scamming and then turn the blame the other way around by accusing of cyberbullying

Something that could only be done in the 80s for sure

It was also free* (MemTurbo was a paid upgrade which didn't remove any adware)

I bet it would work with laserdisc, VCD, DVD, Blu ray, etc. As long as the video matches

8:40 PM

Weirdly forward looking in that regard

8:40 PM

Designed by the same guys who made Teddy Ruxpin if anyone here is old enough to remember that

wipet

it's really something to be accused of scamming and then turn the blame the other way around by accusing of cyberbullying

You're not even making sense. MemTurbo didn't claim to remove adware, it claimed to increase the amount of free memory, which it did nicely, which is why I wrote it in the first place for my own purposes on a congested Exchange server. Do you have any background in computers or is this a new thing?

what about the other products you have released for profit

Lots of them. What about them.

davepl1968

You're not even making sense. MemTurbo didn't claim to remove adware, it claimed to increase the amount of free memory, which it did nicely, which is why I wrote it in the first place for my own purposes on a congested Exchange server. Do you have any background in computers or is this a new thing?

"MemTurbo didn't claim to remove adware" Pay and still get adware on your computer? Do you think it's ethical? Lure people into installing "FREE" software, install them an adware, and keep it on their computers for your own gain

also, i got kicked twice already

wipet

it's really something to be accused of scamming and then turn the blame the other way around by accusing of cyberbullying

tbf if the accusation is voided by the case being solved 20 years ago, then isn't it cyberbullying to bring it up again just for the sake of your own personal satisfaction?

MemTurbo wasn't adware. If you claimed it is, then that's another actionable problem.

davepl1968

MemTurbo wasn't adware. If you claimed it is, then that's another actionable problem.

It was not adware. CPURocket served you the adware module

LotP

tbf if the accusation is voided by the case being solved 20 years ago, then isn't it cyberbullying to bring it up again just for the sake of your own personal satisfaction?

I feel like these guys aren't bothering to use any logic, it's clearly a wasted effort to argue in anyone's favor but their own

VCSMaster

I feel like these guys aren't bothering to use any logic, it's clearly a wasted effort to argue in anyone's favor but their own

fair

We are probably best served by ignoring them, or timeout/mute/kick/ban/whatever they call it this week

8:44 PM

Like I said, simple trolls and nothing more. They're just trying to get a rise out of people

Yeah, and they're clueless on the issues, it now turns out. I'm out for a while, ttyl!

wipet

what about the other products you have released for profit

this question is honestly insane

See ya Dave! My lunch break is over anyways

davepl1968

Yeah, and they're clueless on the issues, it now turns out. I'm out for a while, ttyl!

Thanks all!

Hope the rest of your day goes better than this lol

yeah lol

rogueamp

I don't care if I get pulled in court for this, I swear

Let me see if I can make that happen for you.

LotP

tbf if the accusation is voided by the case being solved 20 years ago, then isn't it cyberbullying to bring it up again just for the sake of your own personal satisfaction?

not everything has to be solely legal--what i mean is morality and legality are separate, some of the software dave released employed immoral tactics, and while this was all solved in court, everyone looks up to dave as this genius ex-microsoft employee, yet not knowing his real past with InternetShield, and some of it involved scams, as much as some of you hate to hear it (edited)

All of this just to avoid responding

8:46 PM

Nicely done, old man

Dave you also shouldn't give him more ammunition

rogueamp

All of this just to avoid responding

by "this" do you mean responding to avoid responding?

LotP

this question is honestly insane

care to elaborate?

I reiterate one last time before I'll leave it be in its entirety, it may be best interest to remove these individuals. Clearly this discussion is unproductive for any number of reasons and leaving them be will only spark similar debates over and over. Someone is trying to get a rise out of someone else and it's not positive behaviour.

anyway since Dave is out, and won't be answering questions i'm gonna put a 4 hour ban on the topic of the 20 year old lawsuit go think about what you're talking about and how you'd feel if someone accused you of a similar situation this practice was normal 20 years ago and you'd be surprised how many companies still do illegal practices today just look up dark patterns, it's very closely related to the thing Dave got sued over if you still have questions feel free to ask them in a civil matter after the ban is over

1

I think it's clear at this point that they are unwilling to comply, and one already said they have been kicked twice.

Michael

by "this" do you mean responding to avoid responding?

responding to something else to avoid responding to actual questions

ban ends in 8/6/2024 1:00 AM (edited)

VCSMaster

I think it's clear at this point that they are unwilling to comply, and one already said they have been kicked twice.

we're fully cooperating and not breaking any rules, i was kicked because one of the moderators simply didn't want me to participate

Thank you, hopefully that will clean up the server for a little while.

wipet

we're fully cooperating and not breaking any rules, i was kicked because one of the moderators simply didn't want me to participate

you should look at rule #3 again and think on what it means

8:49 PM

Despite replacing every vacuum line on my Daihatsu it still doesn't want to run

8:50 PM

Beginning to think it's skipped time because it acts a lot more like it's going to start and run if I twist the dizzy all the way to one side

8:50 PM

I've ordered a timing belt as a result, so on Friday when it shows up I'll start tearing it down and hoping that will fix it lol

Michael

you should look at rule #3 again and think on what it means

none of my messages were slightly toxic or disrespectful, except for poking fun at dave's behavior a few times, but not every argument/heated debate involves disrespect and i think i fully complied with that rule (edited)

8:51 PM

i'll also cooperate with the topic ban as long as no one responds to me (edited)

Well, I tried to steer the topic to something actually useful, but I've run out of free time

wipet

care to elaborate?

i'm just commenting on how, out of context, this question looks super insane lol not saying that you're insane or anything, it was just a fun thing to think about out of context :)

oh i see, i may have worded that wrong

8:53 PM

i guess it would make more sense if i simply said software instead

LotP

i'm just commenting on how, out of context, this question looks super insane lol not saying that you're insane or anything, it was just a fun thing to think about out of context :)

Generally when you release a product you hope to get profit...

yeah :P

wipet

i guess it would make more sense if i simply said software instead

i get what you where trying to say tho

lol yeah

LotP

anyway since Dave is out, and won't be answering questions i'm gonna put a 4 hour ban on the topic of the 20 year old lawsuit go think about what you're talking about and how you'd feel if someone accused you of a similar situation this practice was normal 20 years ago and you'd be surprised how many companies still do illegal practices today just look up dark patterns, it's very closely related to the thing Dave got sued over if you still have questions feel free to ask them in a civil matter after the ban is over

It's obvious this place is pretty unfit for arguments against dave considering the contingent that inhabits the server, but I really hope dave has balls to speak about it in an equal position or maybe just address it, nothing he said countered the points in video, but I guess it's just too obvious and too evident to somehow attempt to disprove and it's just too hard to own up to mistakes in the past, it's easier to go for character assassination "russian troll" whatever, go to court over this "teach me a lesson". Dave's ego is very fragile unfortunately, so this is not happening. All this legal crap doesn't scare me at all, it'll just be a waste of time and money on Dave's part

you could at least wait the 4 hours to send me the message...

9:00 PM

and he left

Wag1 booted on some henny

9:05 PM

reverse engineering overwatch

davepl1968

Let me see if I can make that happen for you.

I really do not want to see this go to court